Big Richard

Sep 5 2009, 10:31 PM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 5 2009, 06:18 PM

Quote:

 

I lol'd at "over manned" the fuck is that, there's no such thing, only under equipped.

What I mean is they had a lot of man power to use, which is how they managed to out produce the Germans

Quote:

 

Anyway ultra, if you didn't know Japan was in dire need of natural resources at the time for its rapidly growing industry, so they went on for conquest, took half of China, and then they turned to some islands south I forget which but it was something important to the U.S. like a supplier or an ally and they knew the U.S. would intervene so they performed a premptive strike.

Yeah, kus America intervened when Britain got bombed.

you don't produce man power, and russia wasn't the most industrial at the time, otherwise it would've had enough guns that the soldiers wouldn't of had to share...



also what? lol? im not even talking about britain.


and incog, we're talking about two different things that happened at two different times

Big Richard

Sep 6 2009, 05:55 PM

ultra, germany had less men, its only right russia had more stuff, doesn't mean they had enough stuff.

and incog, bombing london and bombing an airfield are different things, bombing london would destroy morale, bombing a vital airfield would win the battle.

Big Richard

Sep 6 2009, 05:55 PM

ultra, germany had less men, its only right russia had more stuff, doesn't mean they had enough stuff.

and incog, bombing london and bombing an airfield are different things, bombing london would destroy morale, bombing a vital airfield would win the battle.

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 6 2009, 03:47 PM

You're fucking kidding me, Russia invaded Germany with more than four times as much equipment as their enemies.

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 7 2009, 09:52 AM

Big Richard

Sep 6 2009, 05:55 PM

ultra, germany had less men, its only right russia had more stuff, doesn't mean they had enough stuff.

and incog, bombing london and bombing an airfield are different things, bombing london would destroy morale, bombing a vital airfield would win the battle.

yeah dead, that's what I meant, Russia was overmanned and used this strength to outproduce the Germans.

The Russians were mainly undersupplied during Stalingrad, which seems to be where you're getting all your knowledge on the European front from.

Big Richard

Sep 6 2009, 07:18 PM

thats what im talking about, they were supposed to hit the airfields instead they hit stage props designed to look like an airfield. Hitler needed them bombed for air superiority

Ichigo1uk

Sep 7 2009, 12:51 PM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 6 2009, 03:47 PM

You're fucking kidding me, Russia invaded Germany with more than four times as much equipment as their enemies.

They had 3 times the army and 4 times the Equipment on the eastern front sounds about right.
Russia was a war machine in WW2 and out produced Germany in almost everything.
Only reason they initially lost to be honest was because of superior tactics.


Rich is thinking of WW1.

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 7 2009, 05:31 PM

The battle of Stalingrad was after a surprise attack against Russia, so the nation was unprepared. I doubt Stalin would devote his entire army to the defence of a single city, either.

Russia outproduced Germany during the war, not before it. That's why they didn't have enough guns in Stalingrad. One battle never sets an example for an entire war.

Big Richard

Sep 8 2009, 01:35 AM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 7 2009, 05:31 PM

The battle of Stalingrad was after a surprise attack against Russia, so the nation was unprepared. I doubt Stalin would devote his entire army to the defence of a single city, either.

Russia outproduced Germany during the war, not before it. That's why they didn't have enough guns in Stalingrad. One battle never sets an example for an entire war.

Yes, 2 million russian troops at Stalingrad prepared for a fight was a big suprise to them...it wasn't a suprise attack, they just didn't know where Hitler would strike first, the oilfields or Stalingrad, you don't give people guns right before a fight, soldiers always have their guns throughout a war and even before a war, and he devoted a rediculous amount of soldiers for the "single city" because it was a city to Stalin, it was his image and the last bit of hope Russian's had. If they fought hard at any point during the war, it was at that battle.


and incog, I'm talking about one raid...lol Idk what you were talking about but I'm saying the massive air raid was to destroy the crucial airfield in one bombing run, not a long term thing, so the decoy worked cause it was only one raid.

darkbelg

Sep 7 2009, 08:24 PM

Ichigo1uk

Sep 7 2009, 12:51 PM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 6 2009, 03:47 PM

You're fucking kidding me, Russia invaded Germany with more than four times as much equipment as their enemies.

They had 3 times the army and 4 times the Equipment on the eastern front sounds about right.
Russia was a war machine in WW2 and out produced Germany in almost everything.
Only reason they initially lost to be honest was because of superior tactics.


Rich is thinking of WW1.

learn your historie

the reason russians where loosing was because they wearent prepaired on the attack.
there was a agree ment that germany wouldn't attack russia fore some countries or so.
but when the germans didn't hold their agreement because they where running out of food and russia had plentie.
the russians came in to action and beat the crap out of them.

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 8 2009, 12:10 PM

Big Richard

Sep 8 2009, 01:35 AM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 7 2009, 05:31 PM

The battle of Stalingrad was after a surprise attack against Russia, so the nation was unprepared. I doubt Stalin would devote his entire army to the defence of a single city, either.

Russia outproduced Germany during the war, not before it. That's why they didn't have enough guns in Stalingrad. One battle never sets an example for an entire war.

Yes, 2 million russian troops at Stalingrad prepared for a fight was a big suprise to them...it wasn't a suprise attack, they just didn't know where Hitler would strike first, the oilfields or Stalingrad, you don't give people guns right before a fight, soldiers always have their guns throughout a war and even before a war, and he devoted a rediculous amount of soldiers for the "single city" because it was a city to Stalin, it was his image and the last bit of hope Russian's had. If they fought hard at any point during the war, it was at that battle.


and incog, I'm talking about one raid...lol Idk what you were talking about but I'm saying the massive air raid was to destroy the crucial airfield in one bombing run, not a long term thing, so the decoy worked cause it was only one raid.

The surprise was the declaration of war against Russia. Troops standing between the German army and Stalingrad constantly retreated under commanding orders so they could regroup elsewhere, but Hitler perceived this as the defeat of the Russian army.

Besides, I don't see where you're getting your, "2 million," crap from. Less than 200,000 Russian troops were defending Stalingrad when the Germans invaded the city.

Big Richard

Sep 9 2009, 12:02 AM

Wikipedia says there were 2 million casualties but you're never supposed to trust that.

http://ww2db.com/battle_spec.php?battle_id=3

Big Richard

Sep 9 2009, 12:02 AM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 8 2009, 12:10 PM

Big Richard

Sep 8 2009, 01:35 AM

Ultra-Musketeer

Sep 7 2009, 05:31 PM

The battle of Stalingrad was after a surprise attack against Russia, so the nation was unprepared. I doubt Stalin would devote his entire army to the defence of a single city, either.

Russia outproduced Germany during the war, not before it. That's why they didn't have enough guns in Stalingrad. One battle never sets an example for an entire war.

Yes, 2 million russian troops at Stalingrad prepared for a fight was a big suprise to them...it wasn't a suprise attack, they just didn't know where Hitler would strike first, the oilfields or Stalingrad, you don't give people guns right before a fight, soldiers always have their guns throughout a war and even before a war, and he devoted a rediculous amount of soldiers for the "single city" because it was a city to Stalin, it was his image and the last bit of hope Russian's had. If they fought hard at any point during the war, it was at that battle.


and incog, I'm talking about one raid...lol Idk what you were talking about but I'm saying the massive air raid was to destroy the crucial airfield in one bombing run, not a long term thing, so the decoy worked cause it was only one raid.

The surprise was the declaration of war against Russia. Troops standing between the German army and Stalingrad constantly retreated under commanding orders so they could regroup elsewhere, but Hitler perceived this as the defeat of the Russian army.

Besides, I don't see where you're getting your, "2 million," crap from. Less than 200,000 Russian troops were defending Stalingrad when the Germans invaded the city.

Stalingrad wasn't the first battle fought after Hitler launched his invasion of russia....

also here:

"During this battle, 850,000 German casualties were incurred, in which 150,000 died. The Russian losses were even greater with 800,000 casualties, but they had secured a great moral victory in the city that by now had been reduced to ruins"

that alone is 9 times the number of people you said fought, and this is just casualties. Wikipedia says there were 2 million casualties but you're never supposed to trust that.

http://ww2db.com/battle_spec.php?battle_id=3

ryker

Sep 9 2009, 04:19 PM

another reason that Germany lost that battle was due to the terrain. you have to take into account that there was ALOT of snow and ice on the ground, which of course the Russians were very accustomed to and fought efficiently in. the Germans were at a huge disadvantage and did not fight to their full potential, it wasn't the only reason of defeat in that battle but it was one of the main if not the most distributing factors.

MaxJ

Sep 9 2009, 04:23 PM

There was not very much ice, like on the south pole. The problem was that Germany was very far away and there was hardly any food(too long transportation lines, burned food field by the Russians).

Incy

Sep 9 2009, 07:41 PM

MaxJ

Sep 9 2009, 04:23 PM

There was not very much ice, like on the south pole. The problem was that Germany was very far away and there was hardly any food(too long transportation lines, burned food field by the Russians).

Yea it's just poor logistics, Hitler thought it would be over fast, but Russia is like big.