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Tier List
Topic Started: Jan 10 2008, 03:27 PM (1,531 Views)
LeeChaolan
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I'm Terrible at making tier list so here's one by Throw the Dice over at Shoryoken forums.

Ruccio Roche

Pros: Absurd combos off of anything, quick moves, many of which are safe, fantastic anti-air, and gets in the red at a decent rate. The Zantetsu of Daraku Tenshi; he’s just way too damn solid.

Cons: His reeling hitbox is screwy and REALLY huge since he kicks his leg up, so some combos work on him and no one else. I.e. Torao’s f+HP, HP, LK, HK.


Torao Onigawara

Pros: great normal chains that do good damage and have nice setups, flying kick is great for stuffing things and also a pre-emptive anti-air, touch of death super does awesome damage and has gobs of invincibility.

Cons: Some of his special moves are unsafe.


Upper Tier

Yurian

Pros: wonderful range and speed on her command throw. Can punish a lot of things without meter; I've been thrown in the middle of a HK->HP chain, though it's difficult. Drop kick and running grab are useful for punishing whiffs from a distance. Very few bad matchups.

Cons: charge motions are awkward for a grappler. Overheads can kill her game.

Harry Ness

Pros: Can do some crazy damage with rockets. One full-rocket super can turn an entire match around. Command throw with good damage and a decent anti-air. His b'n'b does massive damage.

Cons: He’s a grappler: big and clunky. Once his rockets are gone, so is his offensive game.

Haiji Mibu

Pros: very damaging combos, surprisingly nimble, Massacre Trumpet is great for messing with the opponent and eats up projectiles, crazy pressure game in the right hands. Good anti-air once you get used to it.

Cons: some of his moves have long recovery times, doesn’t hit the red until he’s got almost no health left. Lacks a good super reversal, which is a HUGE part of DT. Has more noticable problems with the higher-tier characters.

Middle tier:

Taro

Pros: great damage, rekka kens which does good chip damage and isn’t as unsafe as it looks. Lots of moves have high priority from a distance. Great A -> D -> D normal chain.

Cons: sloooow. Most moves, even rekka kens, can be a gamble. Lack of a quick move (even his A is slow) means poor defensive game. Middling anti-air.


Yurien

Pros: Fairly speedy, easy learning curve.

Cons: very, very simple. Spend five minutes with her and you’ll have seen everything she’s got. Dash punch, tiger knee, and flip kick, that’s it.


Bottom tier:

Cool

Pros: some fairly high-priority normals.

Cons: crap damage, impossible-to-perform supers which are near useless, slow, projectile is laughable
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<Hall665> Carlos/Trigger City Ballers 4 life
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ThrowTheDice
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Oh man, I made that thing months ago. I was more or less on the mark with it, but I REALLY underestimated some stuff on that list.

1st thing: Command grabs are beastly. I'd imagine I'd have to move Harry and Yurien up a notch on the list. Seriously, they're all but instant and Harry's does damage like nobody's business. In fact, Harry's biggest strength is his punishing ability. He can stop pressure strings dead in their tracks with his command grabs, his dashing grab can grab whiffed normals, and if you screw up big time and Harry has meter, you can lose up to 80% of your life.

More stuff later.
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GGpatrol
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Nice work throw the dice. Your right about the comman throws Yurian probably lies close to the top with the many combinations she has.
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reelmojo
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Fighting Beggar
For an "unfinished" game it sure was balanced very well. The only thing I can really disagree with on that list is Yuiren. You have to really study him to get the most out of his combos, but once you do he can be devastating. Jumping HK to standing HK, HK to Dashing Punch (or punch super... these moves really need official names) is only the beginning. Also you can mix things up by holding HP when performing her Dashing Punch to cancel the attack, forcing your opponent to block and getting you an easy throw. I'd probably bump him up to High and then bump Yuiran up to Top Tier.

Then I could also make a case for Cool not actually being that bad (as ThrowtheDice himself says). I will add that with some practice his supers (mostly the flash kick one) aren't too hard to pull off. Merlin uses Cool a lot and I've learned that you just can't jump in against him, period. If you do he's going to hit you with a flash kick or the super version. It's not rare to see me get hit by a feather, jump the next one only to get nailed by the flash kick, and then Cool dashes back and starts the whole process over. I'm not saying that he isn't low tier (lack of combos) but when played correctly he's a force to be reckoned with and a testament to how well balanced this game is.

I could talk about moving Haiji up to top tier too but moving everyone up defeats the purpose. I will say that if I could remake the game Detonation Punch would either behave a bit differently or just be weaker in general.
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Plexo
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Carlos's Experiment
Look at this tier list i found in a Brazilian forum.

By 4649/ChibitaJr

S: Torao ( too good - has a parry, instant damaging chains, his escape dash attacks combo, easy damaging desp. moves one of which guard crushes - kind of like a better Gato from KOF XI )
A: Harry Ness, Roche ( both have VERY damaging bnbs with or without meter )
B: Haiji Mibu, Yuiren, Yuiran, Taro ( Haiji has good ass chains and super armor move backed rushdown, but he has problems with Harry, Torao and Rossi - Yuiren and Yuiran have a cancellable parry but that's all they can rely on to chain to combos - Yuiran seems to be a much better character because her multitude of throw setups means she doesn't have to rely on hit confirms - Taro has really good tick damage but he's a big target )
C: Cool ( not very good....relies on throwing slow Black Darts on wakeup and only one good bnb .... charge characters just don't work very well in this kind of system methinks )


Interesting. Harry is pretty high here, and torao is the best.

My personal tier list would be like:

A: Yuiran, Torao
B: Yuiren, Roche, Haiji, Harry
C: Taro, Cool


Until now, the game seems super balanced to me, so, i'm not sure about all this.
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LeeChaolan
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Funny this should come up I've been trying to learn a bit of Cool here lately and I must agree those button comands are not as hard as I originally thought. The game is pretty balanced but I still think in tier terms Roche is top. Most people tend to put Yuiren middle to low but I think he's able to hang with the best. I can see why Torao would be ranked top. He does marvelous chip damage, and does pretty decent damage. His flying kick can nail most anything an opponent may try in the air, and his unblockable super is really easy to punish with due to all the invunerability frames it has. Likewise Harry does AMAZING amounts of damage in the right situation. His basic throws do great damage, and a full rocket super can end the match if the opponent is even a little bit under half their health.
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hall665
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Eden Bar Singer
Yuiren should definately be a little higher in the tiers. I'm no slouch with Roche, but I have gotten the tar beaten outta me by a lot of Yuiren players. He's pretty much the complete package:
-great rushdown capability
-great punishment moves (Knuckle Street & Starlight Dance)
-easy-but-damaging combos (aren't as clunky as a lot of other characters' combos)
-death one he's got you in the corner
-fast as hell (almost no recovery frames after Starlight Dance)

I can buy Cool being low-tier, but he's still dangerous because of his anti-air and wild mix-up strategies.
Knock, knock
Who's there?
Yuiren
Yuiren who?
Yuiren some deep sh*t
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LeeChaolan
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Alot of people don't know it but Yuiren also has an airthrow that tosses opponents out of the air much akin to UMK3's Smoke or Scorpion. The command is a simple D+HP in the air when close to an opponent.
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reelmojo
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Fighting Beggar
The more we play this game the more our opinions on tier lists are going to change, at least for a while. Here's what I'm thinking it is right now, some of these I have a lot to say about, others are more self explanatory.

A Tier

Yurian: Arm Breaker throw has fantastic range, better than most people realize even. She has infinites, but they're difficult enough to preform in the heat of battle that she's still not deserving of her own tier, IMO.

Roche: Options for any situation. Incredible anti-air, long range dashing neck breaker throw, two very useful and very different supers. His windmill (623+P aka Dragon Punch motion) hits both in front and behind him so it's a perfect defense against cross ups.

B Tier

Taro: Very quick and very powerful. His three specials in a row combo (we'll call them Belly Flop, Jumping Uppercut, and Taro Twist) are useful in so many different ways that I'm sure I haven't discovered them all yet. For example, if the Jumping Uppercut hits, instead of doing Taro Twist you can activate his 2x qcf+K super and connect in mid air for huge damage. Also his normals are some of the best in the game, especially for keeping the opponent trapped in the corner. The only reason he's not top tier is because most of his moves lack invulnerability frames.

Harry: So powerful! If he had infinite ammo he'd be top tier. In the right hands even if he's out of ammo he's still dangerous as hell. Projectile is too slow to be of any use though.

Yuiren: Combo combo combo! Low damage output means you have to use his more complex combos to be effective with him though. The dashing punch has amazing range if you hold down the button a bit, or you can hold it long enough to cancel the attack which keeps your opponent guessing.

C Tier

Haiji: Disaster Trumpet is ungodly powerful. "Walk it off!!" has great distance and damage output. His more complex combos can take off nearly entire health bars and his lower jumps aid in his ability to keep the pressure on. So why C tier? All of this is very difficult to use effectively without getting predictable. His uppercut special is too hard to land and sets the opponent up for an air recovery, and Disaster Trumpet is so slow that it almost has to be used as a counter or his opponent will either dash away or jump over him.

Torao: His moves are pretty predictable and other than the flying kick they're all easily countered... especially once you learn the air recovery. His unblockable super is great I have to admit. His parry is only useful in theory. I've never seen it used effectively.

Cool: That's right, I'm bumping him up off of his own tier. He lacks options, this is true, but what he has works amazingly well. His charge times are very low, so you can pull his specials off fast enough to make a casual observer not even realize that he's a charge character. That feather throw has very low damage but it's so fast that it can be hard to avoid. The low charge time on the Flash Kick makes it very versatile. It can be used in short combos, as anti-air defense (obviously), or even a way to bait your opponent into dashing in close allowing you to hit one of those short combos. Also the super version is punishing! And the Level 2 Super version has a fourth kick, so if your opponent doesn't realize you're performing a Level 2 he'll time his attack after the third kick and end up getting nailed by the fourth.


If it feels like I'm dumping on Torao and Haiji, I'm not. Their existence in the lowest tier is really just a testament to how well balanced the game is. Each of them have the power to end a fight in mere seconds. I'm close to believing this game could only have two tiers, or maybe even just one big 8 character level playing field. After all, Cool performs well against even Yuiran and Roche due to the fact that they each have dashing moves that take control away from the player for a brief second which leaves them sitting ducks for a well timed flash kick.
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LeeChaolan
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The game's bosses get a broken tier I believe. Trigger being the top one. The guns have unlimited ammo, the projectile is fast and invincible and hits twice. If standing blocked his super breaks guard and he can anti air with the guns as well as have people fall onto the bullets. Also he has a one button infinite. If you catch someone with his standing HK you can just press it over and over again until they hit the corner and thats the match.

Carlos is good too, his normals do block damage, and his super constitutes a KO if your health is less than perfect. He does however lack Trigger's range and he doesn't (to my knowledge) have an infinite. If anyone could figure that out it'd be Plexo.
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reelmojo
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Fighting Beggar
Ha, yeah I didn't include the bosses but I completely agree with you. It's funny because Carlos is much harder to fight in single player than Trigger is, but Trigger definitely seems better than him in the right hands.
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Plexo
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Carlos's Experiment
I cant believe you put Torao so low and Taro so high. I'm not able to criticize the new tier list because i'm getting rusty with the system, but i have to defend Torao!:

-Ok. The parry doesn't seems to be pretty handy, but you know that parring as been allways difficult to master. Still, i think that you can rely on it as an anti-air when the opponent does a deep jump in.

-I'm not sure, but seems that a blocked jump in into his unblockable super is unescapable, and that is pretty cheap.

-Cr.Hk and lk,Hp are very good pokes.

-Instead of qcf+p, tap p you can do qcf+p,lk,hp or hk. Use the multiple punches just for dealing more damage and finishing a match.


About Taro, I can't tell. I dont know him very well. But bumping up Yuiren and Harry... I agree roundly.
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JLW2490
Black Wing of Zone 4
wow Harry's a high tier that's something.

And sorry to those about DT night, I came but it was really late and Merlin,Hall, and Reel were already playing. I feel asleep a few minutes after.
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Clear Sky
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Fighting Beggar
I saw this on IRC and thought to share with you guys:

[16:28:59] <Rotanibor> Dakaru Tenshi The Fallen Angels
[16:28:59] <Rotanibor> source: http://www10.ocn.ne.jp/~adaki/a-daraku.html
[16:28:59] <Rotanibor> S: Torao Onigawara
[16:28:59] <Rotanibor> A: Musuhasu (Yuiren), Musuran (Yuiran), Harry Ness
[16:28:59] <Rotanibor> A-: Haiji Mibu
[16:29:01] <Rotanibor> B: Cool, Taro
[16:29:02] <Rotanibor> C: Ruccio Roche

Maybe someone here can read what they are saying on that webpage.
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LeeChaolan
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Its one of those you have to fiddle with your language settings to get the font to display correctly or I'd take a look right now. Who was discussing this in an IRC?
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<Hall665> Carlos/Trigger City Ballers 4 life
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