Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to Godlimations. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Tampering with God's creation...; Good, bad or complicated?
Topic Started: 23 Feb 2010, 12:18 PM (922 Views)
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
This thread is a response to a statement made in another discussion, namely that alterations of the human body would be an interesting subject to discuss. I think so too, and would like to start out with a question:

Many say that altering your body is tampering with God's creation, and some think this is a negative thing. Below are a few examples of tampering with God's creation. Do they show that such tampering is always bad, always good, or that it might be a bit more complicated than just yes or no?

1. Rhinoplasty. You didn't like that little bend your noes does, so you straightened it out.
2. Correcting a cleft palate. When you were born, the upper part of your mouth was not fully grown together, surgery can fix that.
3. Piercing your ears or nipples, nose, navel, genitals, whatever. You weren't born with metal rings in your body, but now you have them.
4. Tatoos. Anything from a mole-sized symbol to a body covered in ink. Your body is a painted canvas.
5. Removing a tumor. Some of your cells have been dividing rapidly and was threatening your health. The doctor removes this little bundle of joy from your body.
6. Sterilization. You know, so you can't have babies.

Tampering: Good thing or bad thing?
Edited by Concolor, 23 Feb 2010, 02:00 PM.
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
conradw
Goliath
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
With the exception of the numbers 2 and 5, there's nothing wrong as long as its done tastefully. With 2 and 5, there's nothing wrong even if it's done untastefully.

Might I add to the question? - what about 7. Circumcision?
Edited by conradw, 26 Feb 2010, 07:00 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Hi Conradw. I just added sterilization because I remembered that this was what the discussion originated with. But yes, let's include circumcision as well :)
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Luemas
Member Avatar
DELICIOUS!
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Well, as I believe the body says, to use your body as a temple, to better let dwell the Lord's body. I agree with ConradW for once, except on the matter of 6, and debatable. I mean if you're forced, then no. But if both you and your wife have had enough kids, then maybe it's time to stop. Like with Arazec's Sister in law.

Everything in moderation.
Except Jesus Juice.
Posted Image
I think I'm Crazzzy. I think your crazy. I think your crazzzy... probably.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
dragonshardz
Member Avatar
Troll
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Concolor
23 Feb 2010, 12:18 PM
1. Rhinoplasty. You didn't like that little bend your noes does, so you straightened it out.
2. Correcting a cleft palate. When you were born, the upper part of your mouth was not fully grown together, surgery can fix that.
3. Piercing your ears or nipples, nose, navel, genitals, whatever. You weren't born with metal rings in your body, but now you have them.
4. Tatoos. Anything from a mole-sized symbol to a body covered in ink. Your body is a painted canvas.
5. Removing a tumor. Some of your cells have been dividing rapidly and was threatening your health. The doctor removes this little bundle of joy from your body.
6. Sterilization. You know, so you can't have babies.
1. In my opinion, a waste of money. But if you think that will better help the Spirit to live in you, go right ahead.

2. That's a good thing, since people with cleft palates don't get all the nutrition they need. I know this from personal experience; my little brother was born with a cleft lip and palate.

3. Ear piercings, and maybe understated nose piercings are OK, I think, but piercing your genitals is going way too far.

4. Again, moderation is the key here. I think some tats are fine, as long as they don't outright deny one's Christianity, but whole-body tats are a waste of money.

5. Generally a good idea.

6. Hey, if you can't support any more kids but just can't keep away from your spouse, this is the route to go. Works better than condoms, for sure.
Posted Image
Posted Image

I lurk a lot on this forum, and am very busy in real life, so don't be surprised if I take a couple days, or even weeks, to reply to your post or PM.

GENERATION 11: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any other forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Hm, tampering with God's creation seems a lot more popular than I expected.

@dragonshardz:
Quote:
 
3. Ear piercings, and maybe understated nose piercings are OK, I think, but piercing your genitals is going way too far.
Why? What do you mean by going too far? If it's the amount of piercings you're talking about, then surely one in the genitals is better than one in each ear?

Also why would you accept ear piercings fully, and nose piercings to a lesser degree? How are they different? And how are they different from a navel piercing or a nipple piercing which is less visible than ear piercing?
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

well i need to look up what the bible says about piercings and marking the body again.....
a double standard does exsist with the cultural piercings tho from what i remember...

Quote Post Goto Top
 
dragonshardz
Member Avatar
Troll
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
With ear piercings, I accept them fully because it's become part of the American culture and many other countries' as well. Nose piercings to a lesser degree because it's become popular for girls to have a small gold stud to the left of the bridge of their nose, but having a big bull ring is not my cup of tea.

Navel, well, I dunno. I just didn't mention it. Nipple I don't like, it just looks strange to me.

Genital piercings are too far in the pain department. Ever been kicked in the gonads? Now, imagine that pain, only more piercing and sharper and lasting longer. (I asked a friend of mine with a genital piercing what it felt like. That was his response.)
Posted Image
Posted Image

I lurk a lot on this forum, and am very busy in real life, so don't be surprised if I take a couple days, or even weeks, to reply to your post or PM.

GENERATION 11: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any other forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
@dragonshardz: I see why you would not choose genital piercing for yourself. But what I understand from your post is that you would think any kind of piercing is OK as long as it's sufficiently widespread?
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
dragonshardz
Member Avatar
Troll
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Not exactly. I don't really know how to explain it. It's less of a case that it's widespread and more that it is seen as "normal."

Of course, that leads into a debate of what "normal" is, but let's avoid that.
Posted Image
Posted Image

I lurk a lot on this forum, and am very busy in real life, so don't be surprised if I take a couple days, or even weeks, to reply to your post or PM.

GENERATION 11: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any other forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Let's not avoid that :)

The reason why I used the word "widespread" and not the word "normal" is because I think that the two are so highly connected that in many respects I would count them as one and the same. "Normal" is just how we culturally adapt to things that are "widespread".

There was a time (not many years ago) when piercing your nose was seen as an abomination in many western countries, but when is spread we now think of it as "almost as normal as piercing your ears". Normality is just a product of culture. Culture is just group-think with a lot of people.
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Junior
Member Avatar
Brother-in-law of Soul
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
I think it applies more to what you put in your body, not on it. I firmly believe that God would accept a goth with piercings all over her body, rather than someone with clear skin that drinks like a fish. That's what defiling the temple is. When you live an unhealthy lifestyle you're disrespecting yourself AND God.
Call it what you want
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

i agree God looks at the motives of a person-the inside if you like
but wether you drink like a fish or hang yourself from the clothesline by your nipples its your repentant heart God takes note of eg-is it a rebellious spirit or for the approval of man etc..etc...
the why behind it.
We are urged to search our hearts.

culturally ppl alter their bodies for a myriad of reasons-in biblical times men and women commonly wore earings and other jewellery others cut themselves in pagan worship and then there is the whole mark of the beast thing....

Personally tattoes have never been my thing- i prefer a magna doddle for illustration or dance as a body artform but hey who am i to judge?

i kinda toyed with a few piercings before many were popular -this was before i gave my life to the Lord-afterward they just didnt hold the same importance to me and honesty i liked the noteriety that came along with being a bit "extreme" but God was more than sufficient healing many voids in my life and i no longer craved that type of attention.

Plastic surgery or reconstructive surgeries are in my eyes very different -but again its one we need to navigate.
i mean its a fallen and dying world -we have birth defects and disease etc..etc...and as my doctor puts it-he didnt go to medical school for 9 years to inject botox (in Australia you need to be a Dr to get this stuff) but do you judge someone for wanting to appear younger or more buxom?
i mean the dangers are warned of in the bible-we are urged not to be white washed tombs -perfect and without defect on the outside and empty and dead on the inside....

Widespread normalicy is not an indicater we as Christians are taught to use in our discretion-being "in" the world and not "of" the world and set apart for God its from an eternal perspective we start



Quote Post Goto Top
 
conradw
Goliath
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Junior
26 Feb 2010, 08:34 AM
I think it applies more to what you put in your body, not on it. I firmly believe that God would accept a goth with piercings all over her body, rather than someone with clear skin that drinks like a fish. That's what defiling the temple is. When you live an unhealthy lifestyle you're disrespecting yourself AND God.
Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man. Matthew 15:11

I think there are a few people at AA meetings who would say that God still has time for drinkers. I think there are people in church who would say God doesn't mind a bit of booze as well.

I think you can apply this quote more broadly - there is a difference between having a tattoo of your child's name and having a tattoo of a swastica. It is what you say by your deeds as well as your words which "defileth a man."

Incidentally, this conversation makes me think of this song. I hope you all enjoy it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFoYNVp6k8A
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Concolor
Member Avatar
Barabbas
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
@conradw: song thoroughly enjoyed :D
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Debate · Next Topic »
Add Reply