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Hell and Forgiveness
Topic Started: 2 Feb 2012, 05:32 PM (925 Views)
Luemas
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DELICIOUS!
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So you seem to be leaning more to the fact that there is free will.
Just curious really.
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I think I'm Crazzzy. I think your crazy. I think your crazzzy... probably.
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Calmador
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Concolor
6 Apr 2012, 10:36 AM
If you don't have free will noone needs to force you, as you have no free will tgey need to fight against. Why is God boubd to create free will, is he forced to by something more powerful than himself?

Free will does not mean that you need to create Satan, or humans, or any bad choices. How about a world where you can freely choose between only good things?
If you don't have free will... then your being forced by default. Since you didn't have a choice. God did give us a choice tho.

I think God did because of his character, himself. Not something more powerful, it was his choice.

God didn't create Satan, he created Lucifer and Lucifer decided on his own to become what he is. He also created the tree of life and that gave us a choice... to obey God or to disobey.

A world where you can only freely choose between good things is not a genuine world. How would you know who's good or evil?

So free will obviously exists... I can do 100 jumping jacks right now lol and it makes sense why God would create it and put it into practice by giving us a choice from good or evil.

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Calmador
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Calmador
13 Apr 2012, 02:21 PM
Concolor
6 Apr 2012, 10:36 AM
If you don't have free will noone needs to force you, as you have no free will tgey need to fight against. Why is God boubd to create free will, is he forced to by something more powerful than himself?

Free will does not mean that you need to create Satan, or humans, or any bad choices. How about a world where you can freely choose between only good things?
If you don't have free will... then your being forced by default. Since you didn't have a choice. God did give us a choice tho.

I think God did because of his character, himself. Not something more powerful, it was his choice.

God didn't create Satan, he created Lucifer and Lucifer decided on his own to become what he is. He also created the tree of life and that gave us a choice... to obey God or to disobey.

A world where you can only freely choose between good things is not a genuine world. How would you know who's good or evil?

So free will obviously exists... I can do 100 jumping jacks right now lol and it makes sense why God would create it and put it into practice by giving us a choice from good or evil.

Just wanted to add, that I think I was wrong, the tree of life thing I said.. I dont think its necessary.

Reading Lucifer's story

Isaiah 14:12-14

12 How you have fallen from heaven,
morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
13 You said in your heart,
“I will ascend to the heavens;
I will raise my throne
above the stars of God;
I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly,
on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon.[a]
14 I will ascend above the tops of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.”


It was out of pride that Lucifer became the Devil. He had a choice, without a tree of knowledge or life.

So no tree of life or knowledge is necessary but it's there as a choice for disobedience and Adam and Eve sinned, that's why sin and death is in the world.

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Concolor
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Barabbas
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@Lue: If I had to lean in any particular direction I would lean against the notion that there was free will - simply because I do not see any reason to assume that such a thing exists.

@Calmador:
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If you don't have free will... then your being forced by default.
Why? Does not "forced" mean you're doing something against you will? If you do not have a will, how can what you do be against it?
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I think God did because of his character, himself. Not something more powerful, it was his choice.

God didn't create Satan, he created Lucifer and Lucifer decided on his own to become what he is. He also created the tree of life and that gave us a choice... to obey God or to disobey.
So you're saying that God decided that free will should be created? Why did he do that? If we didn't have free will then all of these problems would have been solved. Also, I would assume he is the one who decided "free will" was supposed to be a good thing, why didn't he just decide that free will was a bad thing and that we should be glad we don't have it?
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A world where you can only freely choose between good things is not a genuine world.
I think it's up to God to decide what's a "genuine" world, don't you agree?
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How would you know who's good or evil?
Well that's the point: there would be no evil. That's why it would be so great. A world with no evil - yay! Why couldn't God just do that?
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So free will obviously exists... I can do 100 jumping jacks right now
Actually, God knew already when he created you that you would do 100 jumping jacks, and by creating you the way you are he basically set that in motion. How can you say that you are free when all your actions are known before they happen by the guy that made you so that you would do them in the first place?
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it makes sense why God would create it and put it into practice by giving us a choice from good or evil.
I actually don't think it makes much sense to introduce evil into the world when you could just have different kinds of good. I don't know about you, but I prefer a world were fewer bad things happen and fewer people are suffering.
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It was out of pride that Lucifer became the Devil. He had a choice, without a tree of knowledge or life.
So why did God invent pride? And why did Lucifer have knowledge without eating of the tree, but Adam and Eve had none before they ate of it?
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So no tree of life or knowledge is necessary but it's there as a choice for disobedience and Adam and Eve sinned, that's why sin and death is in the world.
How would they know that it's a sin before they actually eat the fruit of knowledge?
Life is beautiful, love heals, people come through.

Reason, compassion and love comes first. Everything else is secondary. Except for Skittles. - And emperor Cheezy! Posted Image
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Deleted User
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:ermm: where to start ayyyy

ok about the fruit....
God warned them
they didnt put their trust in him
they could of
but they chose not to
they chose to make their own rules based on their own understanding
much like us when we dont live by faith & think we dont need him
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Luemas
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@Concolor Ok, so if i walked up to you and punched you, you'd be cool with that?

I know, not the best example, but it's an early friday morning.

Es tut mir leid.
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I think I'm Crazzzy. I think your crazy. I think your crazzzy... probably.
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