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The Random Topic; Come... be Random!
Topic Started: Dec 5 2007, 06:29 PM (35,823 Views)
Elystriana
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Guardian and Healer of the Silyena Woods
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You can do it Dark- we're cheering for you! ^_^

Good luck with the Shadow- sounds interesting. And congrats on making it through finals. :lol:


Last night was our Pascha service (Christ is Risen! :) )- it starts at midnight, and we have a big parish feast at 3am afterwards, so I am running on four hours of sleep and Pascha hype and sugar high. :lol:
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Snofox Kari
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o: interesting, celebrating Easter a bit later. what denomination is that?
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towr
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Wasn't it Eastern Orthodox?
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Snofox Kari
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i know she's said in the past, but i just don't remember >.<

the term sounds polish, though
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towr
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It's all Greek to me ;)

I think it actually is Greek (considering the Eastern Orthodox thing, which the forum search confirmed), though it's the same in Latin, and practically the same in Aramaic ( http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=pascha&searchmode=none ).
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TheDeepDark
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Well, that made a subject switch while I was gone. Thanks for all the support! I can See the end now...

Also, Shadow, I echo towr. Haven't played a MUD since waaaay back. (I think technically that's one of the first things anyone in my family ever used the 'internet' for, fun fact!)
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Elystriana
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yep, Eastern Orthodox. Their calculations for Pascha are based on the Julian calendar, which is 13 days behind the Gregorian calendar, so it's often later than western Easter (one week or five weeks).

"Pascha is a transliteration of the Greek word, which is itself a transliteration of the Hebrew pesach Aramaic pascha, both words translated from the Hebrew pesach meaning Passover"
(from the OrthodoxWiki)
I imagine Latin just grabbed it as a loan word. I never did think to look up the etymology of the word before, though. :huh:


On a different note- speaking of Polish, I was talking with some friends about languages yesterday, and one made a joke about the 'Great Vowel Migration'- where all the vowels from Poland moved to Hawaii. XD
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Snofox Kari
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cool XD

ah, well the more formal Easter when everyone is selling chocolate bunnies, is actually run on a lunar calendar, which is why there's such a range in dates that it might occur...seems this one has more of a stable day

I'm not too surprised Latin got it from there, i know in Spanish it's Pascua, so it's easy enough to see the connections :)

and interesting o: never much linked Hawaii to Poland


still, it makes you wonder...we're all celebrating the same thing, all over the world, all Christians and all Jews (minus the Christ part), yet there are different dates in which we actually get to Passover lol
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Elystriana
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Not really more stable, the calculations for both are somewhat similar, if I remember correctly- it's just that the Paschal calculations are based off a calendar that's thirteen days behind the one we use today. XD

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interesting o: never much linked Hawaii to Poland

I don't know that there's really any connection between them- it's more a comment on the fact that Polish words tend to be short on vowels, whereas Hawaiian words have a lot of them. Hence the joke that all the Polish vowels migrated over to Hawaii. :P

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still, it makes you wonder...we're all celebrating the same thing, all over the world, all Christians and all Jews (minus the Christ part), yet there are different dates in which we actually get to Passover lol

Yeah- although I'd argue that, name meaning aside, I'd argue that Pascha/Easter and the Jewish Passover are rather different. :huh:
It's kind of funny though- when figuring when to celebrate church feasts, some Orthodox use the civil calendar (especially those in America, Western Europe), while some use the old Julian calendar (generally in the Russia and the Slavic countries). However, all Orthodox use the Julian calculations for Pascha, specifically so that they're all celebrating it on the same day.
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Snofox Kari
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Sure, Christian celebrations and Jewish traditions are different, but Easter has it's roots in the Jewish Passover which is what Jesus was eating as his last supper (precisely because he was Jewish). Christianity is founded on Judaism with the addition of the new testament... so it should still be the same Passover we'd all be celebrating, just with additional celebrations atop that.

Not that it much matters, just a curiosity lol it's interesting how new traditions evolve and then people separate to do things differently :) No one is right or wrong about it, they just all have different opinions on how (or when) to go about celebrating the same thing...starts off the same, and branches out to multiple variations >w<
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Shadowflight
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Well, if we get it up and running, and actually online, I'll be sure to show you all ^_^
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towr
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Snofox Kari
May 4 2016, 04:40 PM
so it should still be the same Passover we'd all be celebrating, just with additional celebrations atop that.
The Jews celebrate passover to commemorate liberation from slavery in Egypt. Christians celebrate Easter to commemorate the resurrection of Christ. I don't see a lot of similarities.

Sure, you can draw parallels, but frankly how we celebrate Easter inherits a lot more from pagan spring-celebrations than passover. Like the name (in English). And Easter eggs, Easter bunnies, etc.
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Snofox Kari
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Well yeah, that's what it evolved TO, but the root is the same...you can't erase what Passover really is underneath it all just because we've added celebrations to it lol

the problem is that people do tend to forget where current traditions spring from....and then ultimately you get a lot of people who also just think it's all about the Easter Bunny or all about Santa Clause...or it's all about the candy (halloween)

deep down, it's all connected on some level, just evolved when it mixed with other celebrations from other cultures...after all, Christianity is not comprised of one people from one location on Earth, but of different cultures from all over the world and the current traditions reflect that :)

we've ADDED traditions to jewish celebtations (and of course moddified the way it which we celebrate it), but we have not severed that connection...you can't escape the fact that Jesus was Jewish and the last supper was the Passover feast...and in fact, the readings for Easter include the story of Moses and fleeing from Ejypt

the old testament is not thrown out the window, just because we add the new testament ;)
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Elystriana
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Oh I would definitely agree that there are parallels- the Passover and escape from Egypt is seen as a type (prefiguring) of the cross and resurrection. :)
(Although, actually, we read the story of the flight from Egypt Saturday morning, as one of fifteen old testament readings prefiguring Christ's overthrow of death)

Still wouldn't say it's based on the Jewish Passover celebration, though- Holy Thursday Liturgy (where we commemorate the Last Supper), sure; Paschal celebration, no (some of the early church fathers actually specifically made that point- I remember reading about it).
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towr
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It helps that what Jewish passover celebrates very specifically does not apply to gentiles, since we were never an enslaved people in Egypt and so have no reason to celebrate being liberated from it.

It's related, there are parallels, but I really can't see Easter as something that evolved from passover. It's not a continuation of traditions, but something new that sprung up besides it. You said it yourself, the last supper was part of passover, and what we celebrate happened three days later.
The early Jewish Christians will almost certainly have celebrated both, separately, as different things worth commemorating. But I'm not a historian, and I don't even know if records of early Christian Easter celebrations exist.
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