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| The `J` | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 10 2013, 10:44 PM (755 Views) | |
| tc2324 | Dec 10 2013, 10:44 PM Post #1 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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.... and so while I await the finishing touches to my `Fury` conversion, I`ve started to look towards my next 74 build. I think it`s about time I got the `J` up and running. ![]() As you can see I have the excellent Aeroguide for reference and these line of publications really are a type of bible in most ways for building kits. I`m going to finish this in the scheme the aircraft were delivered in which was the very weird greenish/blue/grey as highlighted by the aircraft on the left of following picture..., ![]() Now this come about because the people at the the Naval Air Rework Facility in San Diego really didn`t have a clue to what the US equivalent of Barley Grey or medium sea grey was. So using Federal Standard colours, the J`s left looking a little `sea sick`. One theory is that this green/blue hue was the result of the paint being thinly applied over the deep yellow primer. Anyways, it matters not and quite frankly I don`t think anyone will be able to answer the `why` part now. The question I have, without looking myself is, can anyone suggest a colour paint that might match? Off the top of my head, Tamiya AS-25 Dark Ghost Grey is a similar colour, but not exactly perfect. |
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| Mark M | Dec 10 2013, 11:40 PM Post #2 |
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Hawk T1
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| Olde Farte | Dec 11 2013, 09:30 AM Post #3 |
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Lt. Derek 'Smurfy' Reeve
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Have a look here, http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/magazine/1999/11/stuff_eng_profile_74sqn2.htm just scroll down the page until you reach the Phantom, underneath the illustration they describe the actual colours used. Xtracolor have the Flint Grey as Enamel X143 and I'm not sure if it appeared in their acrylic range.
Edited by Olde Farte, Dec 11 2013, 09:30 AM.
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| tc2324 | Dec 11 2013, 03:18 PM Post #4 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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Cheers Del. Seen that web page before and even though he lists the FS colours the Americans said they used, it`s still debatable if they are actually correct. The FS-36314 is the problem. It is quite simply unlike any samples of it seen anywhere else on any other aircraft. It may be that they used the FS-1 series and not the FS-3 they claimed, due to the `glossy` look the F-4`s had after emerging from the paint shop. A 50:50 mix of Xtracolor Light Blue and Humbrol Barley Grey maybe the answer? |
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| Olde Farte | Dec 11 2013, 03:40 PM Post #5 |
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Lt. Derek 'Smurfy' Reeve
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You could try an overall coat of Zinc Chromate green primer first then a thinnish top coat as McDD did. |
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| DevilFish | Dec 11 2013, 03:43 PM Post #6 |
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LCDR Paul "Voodoo" Carter
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Don't forget, all they did was get these in a flying condition and slap some paint on. Dead rattlesnakes were still being found during servicings in the UK apparently! So, I suspect the story about thin coats over primer is the correct one... |
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| tc2324 | Dec 11 2013, 08:51 PM Post #7 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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Did consider that...., but I`m pretty sure I wouldn`t get the same effect on plastic as you would on metal. Edited by tc2324, Dec 11 2013, 09:18 PM.
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| tc2324 | Dec 11 2013, 09:09 PM Post #8 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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Love the dead rattlesnake story Paul, but I`m pretty sure thats one of those urban myths. There`s no mention of this in the Sqn`s records and it would be the type of story to be mentioned in them. (Although this story may of originated from when the F-4J`s were completely stripped down at San Diego when delivered from Davis Monthan AFB). All the F-4J`s went through SLEP which involved a complete strip down of the airframe as well as adding British systems like the SUU-23A gunpod, wiring for the Skyflash missile and the telescopic sighting system. Thats why I`m pretty sure the rattlesnake story is exactly that. (Unless of course one of our american friends had a sense of humor and `installed` it after..?) The primer explanation seems the most logical, but even that is questioned with some people just blaming natual light reflecting off the aircraft as a probable cause. Solving the JFK shooting might be easier..??
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| tc2324 | Dec 15 2013, 10:00 AM Post #9 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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So after browsing the web for a couple of days, I had a couple of colours in mind for the `hybrid` blue/green/grey but as with all pictures on the net, it`s hard to get a true picture of the actual colour. Then yesterday I was passing my local model shop. It mainly deals with RC models but has a few plastic modelling bits as well, including paint. So I popped in and there it was, a tin of Revell 46 light blue. It looked right to the eye, so I bought it to try it out. It comes across as a kind of duck egg blue which is pretty much how 74`s ground crew described the colour when the J`s first arrived. As they spent a fair bit of time with the jets, it`s hard to argue with what they saw. Here`s the results, the first in artificial light, the second on natural light. Is it close enough? ![]()
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| Olde Farte | Dec 15 2013, 10:03 AM Post #10 |
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Lt. Derek 'Smurfy' Reeve
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Not to my eyes as it's too green, the green is only a tinge seen in certain light other times it is the grey which is predominant. Nobody would complain if you used straight Flint grey I'm sure. |
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| tc2324 | Dec 15 2013, 10:41 AM Post #11 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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Welcome to my world Del...... Like you said, the problem seems to be what light particular photos of the J were taken in and how good the colour perception of the individual is? The following pictures seem to be evidence of this with the first 3 shown in direct sunlight showing off the green/blue, with the last in shade looking very `grey`. (I might have to pretend my display cabinet is sunlight all the time...? )![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Flint grey, while being a reasonable colour suggestion, will not show off the green/blue tint which I`m after, so I need to tackle this from that direction. I`m hoping that a couple of coats of gloss and then a matt varnish followed by a wash might `darken` the paint enough? |
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| tc2324 | Dec 15 2013, 11:16 AM Post #12 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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I`ve just ordered some flint grey. When it arrives some experimentation will be in order me thinks to see if I can solve the `J` question. Now where`s that History channel documentry team...???
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| Olde Farte | Dec 15 2013, 11:22 AM Post #13 |
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Lt. Derek 'Smurfy' Reeve
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Have fun sorting this out. There is another bigger problem in that it all depends on the photo exposure as well, check out the different shades of blue in the sky. So, on that basis I would stick with Flint Grey and be damned. |
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| tc2324 | Dec 17 2013, 01:40 PM Post #14 |
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LCDR Tony `Banana's` Clay
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A couple of bad quality update iPhone shots before I left for the office today. I`ll leave it to you to judge if I`ve reasonably captured the blue/green hue. I received the flint grey as Del suggested, but once tested, it looks way too much like the standard RAF grey and not the weird hue effect I wanted. (Sorry Del, but cheers for the suggestion). It will however look pretty good on the FGR.2 when I get round to it. ![]()
Edited by tc2324, Dec 17 2013, 03:37 PM.
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| Olde Farte | Dec 17 2013, 02:16 PM Post #15 |
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Lt. Derek 'Smurfy' Reeve
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No worries, only too glad to help if I can. I see you mention Slate Grey I presume this is a typo and you meant Flint Grey. When these were refurbished and RAFised they used the nearest grey to the RAF spec so it would appear to be close. Another thing although it's probably too late now but they used the standard USN seats and harness, these weren't changed. |
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