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Mothra Vs. Godzilla(1964); Discuss the film here.
Topic Started: Feb 7 2006, 06:12 AM (10,217 Views)
G2Kmaster
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And sacrifice originality - an important part of making a film criticaly good.
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Godzillaheisei546
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Mar 8 2009, 12:52 AM
And sacrifice originality - an important part of making a film criticaly good.
boredd I have no more furthur comments.
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^It's ok - I had to learn this also. Most of learning this kind of stuff is to help be a good critic who give the film the "devil's advocate" speech. While the usual comming out of the sea would have been great, it would be more impressive and groundbreaking (get it?) for Goji to come out of the ground...
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Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 12:48 AM
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Mar 8 2009, 12:40 AM
^Originality and element of surprise. Not to mention cool.
But still, they could have had them at a dock, and suddenly he rise's fom the sea.
Is there really much continuity (sp?) with most of the Showa Godzilla films? I just always thought Godzilla was asleep at the bottom of the ocean and washed up durring the storm .
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^That is one theorum. We have already debated this...
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Mar 8 2009, 04:50 PM
^That is one theorum. We have already debated this...
It would be easier to just have him enter from the sea, they did it later, and earlier, it just would be easier!
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^Easy? yes. Good? No. Why not good? Used too many times...
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Mar 8 2009, 08:03 PM
^Easy? yes. Good? No. Why not good? Used too many times...
heyo But! they used It in so many other films after!
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Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:19 PM
But! they used It in so many other films after!
Maybe that's why Toho didn't opt for Godzilla's initial appearance to be out of the water, but rather from under the Earth: they wanted to try something different.
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packmule
Mar 8 2009, 08:27 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:19 PM
But! they used It in so many other films after!
Maybe that's why Toho didn't opt for Godzilla's initial appearance to be out of the water, but rather from under the Earth: they wanted to try something different.
big grin big grin Thats proprobly true, most will agree, It would have been alot better if he came out of the ocean in a cool different way.
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Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:41 PM
packmule
Mar 8 2009, 08:27 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:19 PM
But! they used It in so many other films after!
Maybe that's why Toho didn't opt for Godzilla's initial appearance to be out of the water, but rather from under the Earth: they wanted to try something different.
big grin big grin Thats proprobly true, most will agree, It would have been alot better if he came out of the ocean in a cool different way.
Theres not too many ways how to do that... The only way they sproused that up by a notch was Goji's into in Destroyer. When Goji comes out of the earth, it was originality and unexpecting. When he comes out of the ocea,, the SDF are on their way by the time he steps foot on land. When he comes from underground, it took the JSDF a full day to get something done (Japanese print, unless you count the frontier missile, which makes it half a day).
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Mar 8 2009, 09:28 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:41 PM
packmule
Mar 8 2009, 08:27 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:19 PM
But! they used It in so many other films after!
Maybe that's why Toho didn't opt for Godzilla's initial appearance to be out of the water, but rather from under the Earth: they wanted to try something different.
big grin big grin Thats proprobly true, most will agree, It would have been alot better if he came out of the ocean in a cool different way.
Theres not too many ways how to do that... The only way they sproused that up by a notch was Goji's into in Destroyer. When Goji comes out of the earth, it was originality and unexpecting. When he comes out of the ocea,, the SDF are on their way by the time he steps foot on land. When he comes from underground, it took the JSDF a full day to get something done (Japanese print, unless you count the frontier missile, which makes it half a day).
For the last time! I think it would be better for him to rise from the sea, my opinion!
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Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 09:38 PM
G2Kmaster
Mar 8 2009, 09:28 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:41 PM
packmule
Mar 8 2009, 08:27 PM
Godzillaheisei546
Mar 8 2009, 08:19 PM
But! they used It in so many other films after!
Maybe that's why Toho didn't opt for Godzilla's initial appearance to be out of the water, but rather from under the Earth: they wanted to try something different.
big grin big grin Thats proprobly true, most will agree, It would have been alot better if he came out of the ocean in a cool different way.
Theres not too many ways how to do that... The only way they sproused that up by a notch was Goji's into in Destroyer. When Goji comes out of the earth, it was originality and unexpecting. When he comes out of the ocea,, the SDF are on their way by the time he steps foot on land. When he comes from underground, it took the JSDF a full day to get something done (Japanese print, unless you count the frontier missile, which makes it half a day).
For the last time! I think it would be better for him to rise from the sea, my opinion!
ok...
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If you have broadband internet access you can watch a streaming video of AIP's Godzilla Vs The Thing(1964) at this link: http://www.truveo.com/godzilla-vs-the-thing/id/2305843011597710167
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Silk Degrees: Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964) - Revisited

For no particular reason and without any special motivation I decided to watch a Godzilla movie this evening. My choice: the original Toho version of Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964), in Japanese language and English subtitles.

More observations about this film, some familiar and perhaps a few that aren't:

Thumbs up:

1. the abundance of high speed filming used to render Godzilla's movements. This lensing technique makes the action of the monster look slower and more realistic, given Godzilla's size

2. the trio of Akira Takarada, Yuriko Hoshi and Hiroshi Koizumi, who all play off each other very well

3. the score overall is IMO terrific. The main Godzilla "march" helps enhance the urgent, serious tone of the film

4. many of the miniature effects, by Eiji Tsuburaya and his effects team, are excellent

5. comic relief, though not overdone, by the gruff and no-nonsense newspaper editor "Murata"(Jun Takazi) and his affable but bumbling and perpetually boiled egg eating reporter(played by Yu Fujiki). very funny

6. the overall rendering of Mothra, which I thought was outstanding. The wire works staff were no doubt very busy in helping to bring this enormous prop to life in front of the camera

7. the overall battle between Godzilla and Mothra: nothing fancy as both monsters play up to their strengths: Mothra uses her maneuverability advantage in the air, her poison powder and hurricane force winds generated by her flapping wings. Godzilla basically relies on his oral beam, the monster perhaps realizing if he used it enough he would eventually score a hit on his winged adversary(which he did)

8. the JSDF in this movie: these guys actually planned and carried out their attacks on Godzilla with purpose, unlike in other G films where the JSDF come across as being ineffective, unmotivated dullards. In Mothra Vs Godzilla the JSDF leave no doubt of their intent to not only stop Godzilla but also to try and destroy the creature if possible

9. the rendering of the twin Mothra larvae: well done, the two creature's movements appearing to retain a good degree of realism

10, the presence of some truly despicable villains, in particular "Torahata"(Kenji Sahara), a greedy and arrogant shyster who tries to rip off and subsequently jam up his own business associate, "Kumamaya", himself no upstanding individual either.

11. the "Mosugoji" Godzilla suit. No, I don't like the "wobbling lips" but, forgetting that particular shortcoming, I thought the suit looked great overall




Thumbs down:

1. the sequences of the adult Mothra Vs Godzilla battle where hand puppets are used. I have never been nor will ever be a fan of the puppetry arts winky

2. the battle between Godzilla and the twin Mothra larvae: I have no problem with the larvae successfully cocooning Godzilla but I do think those tasked with choreographing this battle made things a little too easy on the larvae. I would have liked seeing Godzilla put up more of a fight against the smaller creatures.

The trailer for Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964): http://fr.truveo.com/trailer-mothra-vs-godzilla-1964/id/3948013570


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About your grievences...
1. Well, thank goodness for that part did have some other footage as shown on the Deleted Scenes reel on the TOHO SFX Tape

2. That person was Haruo Nakajima...
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It just came to my attention, That some wouldn't like Godzilla's wobly lip. But it gives him some more character. Some animals,for example a dog, look like they have a wobly lip. So it gives Godzilla aninmalistic Character. Kida making him more then a rubber suit.
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Conqueror worms: Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964) - revisited

Perhaps the Godzilla film I watched on television most often as a kid was Godzilla Vs Thing, the Americanized version of Mothra Vs Godzilla, which was originally released to theaters back in the spring of 1964. Seems like the American version(released in America by AIP) was on TV quite a bit when I was a kid growing up. If only that had been true for so many other Toho kaiju films. No matter.

I remember my father telling me once he saw Godzilla Vs The Thing while on a business trip in New York. He liked the film but kept pronouncing Mothra as "Mothar". This and the '61 Mothra film are the only two Toho films my father ever saw, both in theaters.

I submit some more personal observations on Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964), my second favorite Godzilla movie(after 1954's Gojira). As always some of these observations may look familiar and some not:

Thumbs up

1. Godzilla's entrance in this film is simply outstanding. The monster's appearance is preempted by the emission of mysterious radiation, a small, shiny radioactive object discovered by photographer "Yoka" Nakanishi and finally strong geiger readings from Professor Miura's geiger counter. All of these things perpetuate an effective accumulation of suspense leading up to Godzilla's appearance. The monster slowly erupts out of the beach, shaking the strata and other debris off himself.

2. the score in this film is IMO outstanding and among my favorites. The opening theme nicely projects what will be the serious tone for this film, set against the backdrop of heavy winds and seas caused by Hurricane Abe. Watch this opening sequence and you definitely get the impression the movie is going to be a serious treatment of Godzilla and the other elements of the film.

3. the special effects are marvelous. There are, to be sure, some things I didn't like: the puppet effects and what looked like limited stop motion effects are things I could easily have done without. Overall, however Eiji Tsuburaya and his technical staffers created some great effects: the animatronic larval and adult Mothra are terrific, the use of high speed filming is liberal which meant the vast majority of monster movements were slowed down as they appeared on screen, adding realism to the actions by Godzilla and the adult/larval Mothras. I also liked the fact that Godzilla's use of his oral beam was not over-done. The creature employed the weapon mostly when engaged with the adult Mothra and the twin larvae. The larval Mothra's use of silk, the two creatures relentlessly spraying it at Godzilla was also an extremely well rendered sequence. I also like the napalm attack on Godzilla by the defense force airborne bombers. At one point Godzilla appears to briefly be on fire. This effect may have been unintended but it looks good on screen. The miniatures also look great, especially the structure built by Happy Enterprises to house Mothra's huge egg.

4. the human cast in the film: these characters play off each other well, especially the conflicting personalities of no-nonsense reporter Sakai(played by Akira Takarada) and his free spirited, female photographer Junko "Yoka" Nakanishi(played by Yuriko Hoshi). Comic relief is supplied by boiled egg eating reporter Jiro Nakamura(played by Yu Fujiki) versus his gruff, surly boss, the newspaper editor Arota(played by Jun Takazi). Nakamura seems to regarded by his editor as a slacker and the clashing personalities here are often funny. In the English dubbed AIP version the egg eating, bumbling Nakamura tells photographer "Yoka" Nakanishi at one point that he fears his editor boss more than Godzilla.

5. the adult Mothra: I've read about how this creature was rendered for the film and I can only imagine the difficulties that Eiji Tsuburaya and his effects crews had bringing the monster to life. The adult Mothra looks terrific and provides Godzilla with a good battle.

6. the human cast villains in the film: both are played to the hilt. First up is Kumayama(played by Yoshifumi Takima), a jittery fellow and pompous jackass who is owner of "Happy Enterprises". The name of this company couldn't possibly contradict the demeanor of Kumayama more as evidenced by Kumayama's testy relationship with the local fishermen and the human protagonists, even the Shobojin fairies(played the Ito twins Yumi and Emi). Kumayama is a man who seems to possess a general disdain for people altogether. Kumayama's business partner is Banzo Torahata(played by Kenji Sahara), a self aggrandizing, nefarious and greedy man, who would likely steal from his own mother if he needed the money. The character of "Torahata" is well played by Kenji Sahara and is IMO among the best villains of the classic Toho kaiju films, ranking right up there with Jerry Ito's performance as the despicable, egomaniacal "Clark Nelson" in 1961's Mothra and the creepy Xian leader played by Yoshio Tsuchiya in 1965's Invasion Of The Astro Monsters.

7. the "Mosugoji" Godzilla suit: there is considerable disdain among Godzilla fans for Godzilla's "wobbly" lip in this film. I understand the quibble but for me it detracts nothing from the film overall. The exaggerated and furrowed eyebrows lend a kind of "perma-scowl" to the monster's face. Given Godzilla's role in this movie as rampaging antagonist this effect works well. I also like the overall physique of the suit: the shoulders could IMO have been a little more pronounced but the rounded edges of the dorsals and long, rounded at the end tail all look good.


Thumbs down

1. there were various distant shots of the adult Mothra-Godzilla battle that I thought looked kind of shaky.

2. the scene where Godzilla first enters a city setting: I would have liked seeing a longer sequence of the monster in a city setting. Even the Godzilla-adult Mothra battle in a city would have been preferred.

I know many younger fans may label this movie as "dated and boring", especially as it compares to the updated effects(CGI and otherwise) in today's films. When considering what Ishiro Honda, Akira Ifukube and Eiji Tsuburaya managed to create together with this film, I think this film stands the test of time quite well, a testament to the skills and imagination of these three men and those at Toho who worked for them in the creation of this movie. thumbz up


The HD trailer for Mothra Vs Godzilla:

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Russzilla
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All good points Pack. This G movie will always hold a special place with me being that it was the very first Godzilla movie I ever watched. Thanks Dad for taking me.

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This is my definite favorite of the Showa Era films. I have always felt there was a golden age for Kaiju movies. It started sometime around 1959, and ended after Invasion of Astro Monster (with IOAM being the low point). This movie has intriguing characters, an amazing musical score, and dramatic monster battles. I still get goose bumps at the ends of each fight. The same musical score at the end of each battle is able to convey two different emotions for me. When adult Mothra is dying, the score to me accentuates the drama. The same music is played as Godzilla is dumped into the sea at the end, and it some how conveys the happiness of the situation; the fight is over, and the larvae have gotten revenge for their mother. I might just be rambling however lol.

I actually like the Godzilla costume for this one. I love the thick eye brows, they make him look really evil.

This is and will always be one of my favorites from the Showa Era.
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After reading through the entire thread, I have decided to post my updated opinion on Mothra vs Godzilla (1964). winky

THE THINGS I LIKED:

The Godzilla suit (Minus the wobbly lip)

Most Of The Special Effects

The Adult Mothra Prop

The Human Characters

The Score


THE THINGS I DIDN'T LIKE:

The Wobbly Lip (It was IMO very distracting and annoying)

The Two Mothra Larvae props (I saw some footage from the 1961 Mothra film, the Larvae in that film looks great but in MvsG the larvae's don't look as good IMO)

Godzilla wasn't all that terrifying and seemed pretty weak (My reasons for saying this: Godzilla getting his tail caught in into a tower and it falls on him, Godzilla tripping and slamming into a building, Godzilla missing the dying adult Mothra many times with his atomic ray)

The Climax (Getting defeat by two newly born larvae's with no fighting experience is IMO a weak idea)


Overall I give this film a 6.5/10. Mr. Smiles
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It seems like they were trying to make Godzilla less threatening. Half of the stuff he destroyed in the movie was an accident. Got his tail caught and fell of the Castle
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Rodan70
Apr 13 2011, 12:22 AM
It seems like they were trying to make Godzilla less threatening. Half of the stuff he destroyed in the movie was an accident. Got his tail caught and fell of the Castle
I think the idea of making Godzilla less threatening was a terrible choice, if he destroyed those things on purpose then I would have gave the film a higher score. winky
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gojiramatthew
Apr 13 2011, 12:30 AM
I think the idea of making Godzilla less threatening was a terrible choice
I don't think Toho's intent was to make Godzilla "less threatening" in this film. Why would they? He is, after all, the "bad guy" in the movie, threatening Japan and with Mothra the proverbial "good guy" character who volunteers to try and stop him.

The scene where Godzilla loses his footing and crashes into the giant castle was actually unintended: Haruo Nakajima lost his footing inside the suit. It was decided to keep the scene in the film. Perhaps rebuilding the castle for a re-shoot was deemed by Inoshiro Honda(the film's director) too time consuming and/or expensive. I know from reading several G books that rebuilding these sets for re-shoots was time consuming.

I haven't read anything that would suggest that Godzilla getting his tail caught in the tower was unintended although it wouldn't surprise me if it was simply another miscue by Haruo Nakajima in the suit.

Personally, I would have liked seeing a longer sequence of Godzilla rampaging in a city setting, and done without these suit miscues. A longer and mistake free sequence of Godzilla destroying a city(or a large part of it) would have more effectively established the monster as a grave threat to Japan as opposed to what we actually saw in Mothra Vs Godzilla. I understand and empathize with Godzilla fans that these suit mistakes are a point of criticism among the fandom. winky
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The scene where Godzilla loses his footing and crashes into the giant castle was actually unintended: Haruo Nakajima lost his footing inside the suit. It was decided to keep the scene in the film. Perhaps rebuilding the castle for a re-shoot was deemed by Inoshiro Honda(the film's director) too time consuming and/or expensive. I know from reading several G books that rebuilding these sets for re-shoots was time consuming.


I'm aware of this already Packmule, still quite a shame through... the film would be better if a re-shoot was made IMO. winky

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I understand and empathize with Godzilla fans that these suit mistakes are a point of criticism among the fandom. winky


I don't see many G-fans complaining about the mistakes in this film, I thought I was the only one. huh?
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gojiramatthew
Apr 13 2011, 06:31 AM
I'm aware of this already Packmule
heyo

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I don't see many G-fans complaining about the mistakes in this film, I thought I was the only one
I've seen similar criticism of this film at the ATARI Godzilla forums, Toho Kingdom and Monster Zero. Most of the criticism is aimed at the "wobbly lip" and Godzilla's stumbling after getting his tail caught in the tower.
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I'm going to take a second to write the Pros and Cons of this film.(For Me)

Pros:
Godzilla Himself: A Very Menacing Looking Godzilla, More scary then the King Goji and Raids Again Godzilla. As Well as some Memorible Eye-Brows.
Special Effects: The Effect that stands out to me the most is the Egg. When the Human cast stands next to it, I really don't know how they did it.
Kenji Sahara: My favorite Human Villian from the Godzilla series. Most Human Villians in a Godzilla Film are Over the Top and Comic Book Like, But here you actually want to punch the guy, thats good acting.
Godzilla's First Apperance: Is Suprising and Cool, The Use of Slow Mo is used Well.
Music: No Comment, It's just good.
Cons:
Godzilla First Apperance: Yah it's cool, But I never thought it made sense, Why Would Godzilla Rise from the Ground, when in the last film he fell in the ocean, Fans say he was KO'd, then Wound up on shore like a Beached Whale, then was Buried. I Don't think Ishiro Honda was thinking that when he made it, because of how far fetched it seems.

Thats my only con, which is really more of a Nitpick then anything.
Easily one of the top contenders for Best Showa Goji Film and Also stands out as one of the best.
Edited by Godzillaheisei546, Apr 13 2011, 06:59 PM.
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Godzillaheisei546
Apr 13 2011, 06:59 PM
Godzilla First Appearance: Yah it's cool, But I never thought it made sense, Why Would Godzilla Rise from the Ground, when in the last film he fell in the ocean, Fans say he was KO'd, then Wound up on shore like a Beached Whale, then was Buried. I Don't think Ishiro Honda was thinking that when he made it, because of how far fetched it seems
I've seen some message board content(at other boards) about the premise for Godzilla's first appearance in Mothra Vs Godzilla(1964). Godzilla being washed ashore and buried under tons of sand and silt by a powerful hurricane(as was the case in this film) seems plausible to me: Pacific typhoons are frequently more powerful than their counterpart Atlantic ocean hurricanes. A Pacific Ocean typhoon with sustained winds approaching 200 MPH would, I think, be capable of washing large objects ashore.

What struck me as odd, more than anything, was how Godzilla would remain unconscious(or asleep) throughout this process of being deposited by the hurricane at the beachfront development site and buried under tons of sand. ? heyo

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Now this is the kind of discussion I've missed! I, too, would loved to see more of the destruction of the cities. I just wonder what their thought process was when they decided to make Godzilla get his tail caught on that tower.
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"Packmule"
 
What struck me as odd, more than anything, was how Godzilla would remain unconscious(or asleep) throughout this process of being deposited by the hurricane at the beachfront development site and buried under tons of sand. ? heyo


Probably because he was suffering from a hangover from drinking a lot of beer. tongue-1

Or that King Kong managed to whack Godzilla repeatedly across the head after both of them fell into the water. winky
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