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I'm not going to knight Tom Crean yet...; (No pun intended)
Tweet Topic Started: Feb 24 2009, 12:41 PM (631 Views)
brumdog44 Feb 24 2009, 10:09 PM Post #31
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dcamden03
Feb 24 2009, 09:15 PM
How does one predict this many wins when you have never seen half of the team play a college basketball game? Who transfers? Who gets better? Who regresses? Who doesn't make it to campus? Which recruits adjust to college basketball well? Which adjust bad?



The same way someone magically predicts Purdue will be ten points better than last year.
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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 10:21 PM Post #32
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brumdog44
Feb 24 2009, 10:09 PM
dcamden03
Feb 24 2009, 09:15 PM
How does one predict this many wins when you have never seen half of the team play a college basketball game? Who transfers? Who gets better? Who regresses? Who doesn't make it to campus? Which recruits adjust to college basketball well? Which adjust bad?



The same way someone magically predicts Purdue will be ten points better than last year.
You mean by watching both teams play over 20 games each? I have an opinion based on what I saw.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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tAmazingHoosier0305 Feb 24 2009, 10:49 PM Post #33
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Predicting records for the next 3 years is not only inaccurate, isn't it somewhat pointless?

20 is definitely feasible for next season... but a big part will be how much of an impact Bawa Muniri, Elston, and Capobianco make as freshmen helping Pritch down low, and how much better our underclassmen get over the next year.

Watford will put on.. he's got the NBA hype thing to live up to. Plus, from what I've been seeing, most of the players are committed to play for coach Crean and Indiana solely for those 2 reasons. Meaning, it wouldn't be crazy if Watford stayed another season or even 2.

A lot of people forget we'll have a senior starting PG in Jeremiah Rivers, who was the PG for the Elite 8 Georgetown team just a year ago. He's been practicing with the team this year, getting to know the system... and he's experienced. The sky is the limit, I think these kids have seen what happens when a team ISN'T motivated about basketball and if their opportunity is taken for granted.

I'm awfully optimistic.
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dreachon Feb 24 2009, 11:04 PM Post #34
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too optomistic i think
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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:06 PM Post #35
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Feb 24 2009, 10:49 PM
Predicting records for the next 3 years is not only inaccurate, isn't it somewhat pointless?

20 is definitely feasible for next season... but a big part will be how much of an impact Bawa Muniri, Elston, and Capobianco make as freshmen helping Pritch down low, and how much better our underclassmen get over the next year.

Watford will put on.. he's got the NBA hype thing to live up to. Plus, from what I've been seeing, most of the players are committed to play for coach Crean and Indiana solely for those 2 reasons. Meaning, it wouldn't be crazy if Watford stayed another season or even 2.

A lot of people forget we'll have a senior starting PG in Jeremiah Rivers, who was the PG for the Elite 8 Georgetown team just a year ago. He's been practicing with the team this year, getting to know the system... and he's experienced. The sky is the limit, I think these kids have seen what happens when a team ISN'T motivated about basketball and if their opportunity is taken for granted.

I'm awfully optimistic.
I agree with Bawa, Elston, and Capo having to be major help, also have to throw Watford in there. He's an ideal 4 man in Crean's system.

Watford and NBA? Watford is at the earliest a 3 year guy, and more than likely 4.

Georgetown didn't make the Elite 8 last year, they lost in the second round as a 2 seed to Davidson. Rivers was the 8th or 9th guy in the rotation and did not start. In the Final Four season, Rivers was the 8th guy (11 minutes a night) in a 7-8 man rotation (Ewing Jr was #7 FWIW at 14 minutes a night).

Rivers will bring experience, but the sky is not the limit with him. He is what he is, a solid, not great perimeter defender, and a solid ball handler. That'll will be a good thing to have, but you are overstating his track record and ability a bit.

Optimism is good, you guys will definitely be improved. The class is solid, and they will be a key part to turning this thing around. But its not exactly what you seem to make it out to be. 20 wins next year will be a big task. Its impossible to predict as you are adding so many players that none of us have an idea of how they'll adjust to the college game and the roles being asked.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:07 PM Post #36
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Feb 24 2009, 11:04 PM
too optomistic i think
lol

You said in 4 words what I said in 4 paragraphs.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dreachon Feb 24 2009, 11:12 PM Post #37
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Dcam, while yer right about Rivers not playing much on Gtwon (hence why he transferred) everything I've read about him is that he is a superb defender and limited offensively. In fact, I think the entire reason why he played at all on Gtwon was to come in and help lock down certain players. Just going by what I've heard about him.
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timpickett22 Feb 24 2009, 11:13 PM Post #38
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dcamden03
Feb 24 2009, 11:07 PM
dreachon
Feb 24 2009, 11:04 PM
too optomistic i think
lol

You said in 4 words what I said in 4 paragraphs.
thenage would be proud.... lol
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obatskii Feb 24 2009, 11:15 PM Post #39
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No matter how good offensively or defensively Rivers is, I just think about seeing him out there compared to Danielle Moore, and that there makes me smile :)
Edited by obatskii, Feb 24 2009, 11:16 PM.
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tAmazingHoosier0305 Feb 24 2009, 11:20 PM Post #40
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Was Gtown in the Elite 8 the year before? Could have sworn they were lol

Knew he didn't start, but he got quite a bit of playing time. I saw him play a lot..

Thanks for clearing that up tho nage, I mean, DC =P
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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:20 PM Post #41
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Feb 24 2009, 11:12 PM
Dcam, while yer right about Rivers not playing much on Gtwon (hence why he transferred) everything I've read about him is that he is a superb defender and limited offensively. In fact, I think the entire reason why he played at all on Gtwon was to come in and help lock down certain players. Just going by what I've heard about him.
I can't see a player that is a superb defender getting under 20 minutes a night, especially at Georgetown. Thats sort of their thing. They only gave up 58 a night in the Big East.

We'll see. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, I'm sure he is a plus on the defensive end, but I've heard from some IU fans "best perimeter defender in the Big East", "great defender who will just lock people down", and so on. If you are a lock down defender, you don't play 18 minutes a night IMO.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:21 PM Post #42
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Feb 24 2009, 11:15 PM
No matter how good offensively or defensively Rivers is, I just think about seeing him out there compared to Danielle Moore, and that there makes me smile :)
Definitely a step up from Moore, no denying that.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:22 PM Post #43
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tAmazingHoosier0305
Feb 24 2009, 11:20 PM
Was Gtown in the Elite 8 the year before? Could have sworn they were lol

Knew he didn't start, but he got quite a bit of playing time. I saw him play a lot..

Thanks for clearing that up tho nage, I mean, DC =P
G'town was in the Final Four his freshman year and lost in the second round his sophomore year.

He averaged 11 minutes as a freshman and 18 as a sophomore. He was 7/8/9 in the rotation his whole career.

He's an upgrade, not really sure if he's a difference maker though.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dreachon Feb 24 2009, 11:29 PM Post #44
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Feb 24 2009, 11:20 PM
dreachon
Feb 24 2009, 11:12 PM
Dcam, while yer right about Rivers not playing much on Gtwon (hence why he transferred) everything I've read about him is that he is a superb defender and limited offensively. In fact, I think the entire reason why he played at all on Gtwon was to come in and help lock down certain players. Just going by what I've heard about him.
I can't see a player that is a superb defender getting under 20 minutes a night, especially at Georgetown. Thats sort of their thing. They only gave up 58 a night in the Big East.

We'll see. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, I'm sure he is a plus on the defensive end, but I've heard from some IU fans "best perimeter defender in the Big East", "great defender who will just lock people down", and so on. If you are a lock down defender, you don't play 18 minutes a night IMO.
I feel ya on that one. I honestly think it's just that his offense was so bad and I'm sure the other guards were good enough defensively. Anyways, here's a bit of what I'm talking about. An article about his transfer states he was the team's defensive specialist being assigned to the opposing team's best player like Derrick Rose, Scottie Reynolds, Stephon Curry, and Johny Flynn. I can see a scenario where Hulls would run the point on offense and Rivers would guard the PG on defense.

Quote:
 
The 6-foot-4 Rivers struggled offensively during his two seasons at Georgetown, but he carved out a niche as a defensive specialist. He was often the first guard off of the bench and averaged 18.6 minutes per game as a sophomore. He shadowed some of the country's top guards last season -- Memphis's Derrick Rose, Villanova's Scottie Reynolds, Syracuse's Jonny Flynn and Davidson's Stephen Curry -- and the Hoyas credited his late-game defense with helping them eke out narrow victories over Syracuse and Villanova.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/07/AR2008050703588.html
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dçamden03 Feb 24 2009, 11:36 PM Post #45
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Hmmm. He played 16 minutes against Rose (who had 18 points, 6 assists). 16 minutes against Curry (30 points, 5 assists). 13 and 22 against Flynn (averaged 20 points in two games). 9 and 15 minutes against Reynolds (24 points in the 15 minutes game, 13 points in the 9 minutes game).

I'm not saying he is a bad defender, but I'm not sure he's a great one either.

I can't see Hulls guarding anybody but the other teams' PG. He's listed at 6'0 170. I'm not sure you'd want him on many wing players in the B10.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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