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| U.S. Banking system | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 2 2009, 09:11 AM (318 Views) | |
| troubleatiu | Jun 3 2009, 06:55 AM Post #16 |
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listen asshole, you get on me for "always looking for a fight" after its your dumbass thats baited me just like this. the fed was created in 1913. the income tax was passed in 1916. are those numbers accurate? YES. our tax money goes to pay the interest on the money we borrow from the fed. this is so obvious and yet youre the only one who doesnt see it? that was not an ignorant statement. ignorance is in not knowing. i know. the 2nd is directly related to the first. stupidity is in not knowing but dismissing anyway. thats the approach youve taken for a long time. not only are you erroneous in calling me ignorant; you fit the definition of stupid. shove your banking opinions up your ass; they definately dont belong in the light of day. and if you want any respect from me, quit baiting me. this isnt your tv show where you can hit and run then turn my mike off or break for commercial dumbass. |
![]() "The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer."--Henry Kissinger "What luck for rulers that men do not think."- Adolph Hitler "Terrorists don't want your freedoms--they want your life. It's dictators and tyrants who want your freedoms."-author unidentified | |
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| HoosierLars | Jun 3 2009, 08:46 AM Post #17 |
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Trouble:
Ummmm...., no, the income tax was started in 1913: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution Einstein, why don't you study these two lists and figure out which events caused which. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1913 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1916 And for the record, I tried to be civil with you for a long time, but you started the name calling and belittling. If you want a message board war, bring it, I'm not backing down. Edited by HoosierLars, Jun 3 2009, 09:00 AM.
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| yawnzzz | Jun 3 2009, 12:18 PM Post #18 |
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| HoosierLars | Jun 3 2009, 12:45 PM Post #19 |
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| eelbor | Jun 3 2009, 02:31 PM Post #20 |
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Darn, you beat me to it. I was gonna play a 'best of eelbor' repost of my bebunker of the water-gas snakeoil salesman logic. Ah hell, I will anyway. Aaron. It is impossible to get more energy out of the hydrogen in your hillbilly car experiment than you put into splitting the water in the first place. The solar panel is quite a different story. Solar power is free energy, being converted to a storage mechanism. In this case it is stored as hydrogen gas.
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![]() "Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder. | |
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| Mr Gray | Jun 3 2009, 03:04 PM Post #21 |
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eel, how would you calculate the "energy" it takes to poor the water into a canister mounted next to the engine, because that is essentially all of the energy it required. The battery does create the charge which seperates the hydrogen, but the alternator is charging the battery using much less energy than the hydrogen creates when burned in the intake. |
![]() The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism. | |
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| HoosierLars | Jun 3 2009, 03:17 PM Post #22 |
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You're dead wrong on this, Aaron. You will always spend more energy creating the hydrogen than you get from burning it later. There are always loses in any real electrical-mechanical system. If there was any truth to this urban myth, UPS, FedEx, and most trucking companies would be using this technique to fatten their bottom line. |
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| Mr Gray | Jun 3 2009, 03:20 PM Post #23 |
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so I suppose that I use just as much energy pumping gas into my car as my car does driving 300 miles on it huh? You are dead wrong on this one Lars....energy is being used sure, but it is already stored up in the form of the exposive material (gasoline, hydrogen...etc) |
![]() The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism. | |
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| eelbor | Jun 3 2009, 03:21 PM Post #24 |
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Now, if you were to coat your car with solar panels to split water molecules, you could harness some energy from the sun to do your dirty work, but if you are using a combustion engine to generate electricity to split the water you are inputting more energy than you are getting back out. |
![]() "Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder. | |
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| eelbor | Jun 3 2009, 03:26 PM Post #25 |
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The energy is not put into the gasoline by you pumping it into the tank. The energy in the gasoline is in its chemical bonds. The energy in the hydrogen gas comes at the expense of splitting some very stable bonds in the water. In this case, the hydrogen gas is acting as a battery for you. It wants to go back to being water, and will release energy to do so. That energy released is slightly less than the cost of splitting the water in the first place. |
![]() "Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder. | |
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| Mr Gray | Jun 3 2009, 03:44 PM Post #26 |
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I really don't think so. If there were no other factors, then yes, but the fact that it is in a car and the alternator is partially run off of the rotation fo the wheels which can happen without any fuel being injected at the moment (coasting). Bottom line is that the charge of electricity required to split the H2O is much less than the energy created when burning that same amount of hydrogen. |
![]() The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism. | |
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| HoosierLars | Jun 3 2009, 04:19 PM Post #27 |
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"Bottom line is that the charge of electricity required to split the H2O is much less than the energy created when burning that same amount of hydrogen." If this was really true, the Arabs would be pounding sand, because you just discovered a virtually free, endless energy source. You're an entrepreneurial business man, Aaron. Why don't UPS and FedEX use water-gas to save millions per year in fuel costs? The answer is anyone with knowledge of chemistry/physics laughs at this urban legend. Eel, you get the next one. |
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| thePhilosopher | Jun 3 2009, 04:26 PM Post #28 |
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So what does a water car have to do with the US banking system? :p |
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| HoosierLars | Jun 3 2009, 04:34 PM Post #29 |
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Sorry, Phil, I'm losing it. :P Trouble's rant about the income tax being started in 1916 to pay the interest on the Fed money put me over the top. I would expect you, oldschool and other posters to call bullshit on that one. It's ok for you guys to disagree now and then. |
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| eelbor | Jun 3 2009, 04:40 PM Post #30 |
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Welcome to the exciting world of the law of conservation of energy. The law of conservation of energy states that the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant. A consequence of this law is that energy cannot be created or destroyed. If your argument is that you have found a way to run engine energy that would otherwise be wasted back through the engine that is one thing. If you are claiming you have found a free energy source that is another thing altogether. Keep in mind that modern combustion engines are about 25-30% efficient. You waste 70% of the energy in gas. You will also waste 70% of the energy in whatever minute quantities of hydrogen your electrolysis creates also when you burn it. All in all, it will take more energy to create the hydrogen than you will get back by burning it. |
![]() "Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder. | |
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