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Are you in favor of Cap & Trade
Tweet Topic Started: Jun 27 2009, 09:48 PM (278 Views)
gallopingboiler Jul 13 2009, 03:49 PM Post #16
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brumdog44
Jul 2 2009, 09:06 PM
From what I know of it, know. But what I will admit to is simply not knowing enough about it.

In NW Indiana, we have to get our car's emissions tested because of the polution that the steel mills cause....the mills simply find it more practical to pay the fines that to change their emissions. In the end, I think cap and trade doesn't really solve the problem.

Then again, I'll admit that I really am behind on this one and haven't looked into that much.
I've worked in steel mills and steel processing since i've been out of school (3 years). The issue with cap and trade with steel is that energy (and carbon emissions) are two of the most expensive parts of the production of steel. If you look at the reduction of energy inputs in the united states and the EU vs. the middle east and far east you would notice that the reduction is drasticly more for the US in the last 50 years.

The problem is that china and russia will not put cap and trade legislation into effect so the additional costs of energy and producing emissions cannot be passed on to the consumer crippling the US steel industry and laying off workers for one of the few manufacturing industries left here.

My point here is that the good for society and for the steel companies to become more efficient is one in the same. Higher effeciencies produce less CO2 and consume less energy reducing cost per ton while making the communities where these steel mills reside cleaner and healthier. This motivator has worked for US steel industry for the last 50 years and will continue into the future. IMO, cap and trade will only reduce the total production of steel in the US resulting in lost jobs instead of allowing the industry to grow (like it was before the recession) and becoming cleaner at the same time.

I agree that Cap and Trade is not the best solution to solve out polution problems.
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HoosierLars Jul 15 2009, 09:20 AM Post #17
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gallopingboiler
Jul 13 2009, 03:49 PM
The problem is that china and russia will not put cap and trade legislation into effect so the additional costs of energy and producing emissions cannot be passed on to the consumer crippling the US steel industry and laying off workers for one of the few manufacturing industries left here.
Exactly, but the B.O. misadministration doesn't get it.
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boilergrad01 Jul 15 2009, 09:41 AM Post #18
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HoosierLars
Jul 15 2009, 09:20 AM
gallopingboiler
Jul 13 2009, 03:49 PM
The problem is that china and russia will not put cap and trade legislation into effect so the additional costs of energy and producing emissions cannot be passed on to the consumer crippling the US steel industry and laying off workers for one of the few manufacturing industries left here.
Exactly, but the B.O. misadministration doesn't get it.
I think they do Lars. They need higher unemployment to increase the need for social programs.
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HoosierLars Jul 15 2009, 09:49 AM Post #19
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boilergrad01
Jul 15 2009, 09:41 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 15 2009, 09:20 AM
gallopingboiler
Jul 13 2009, 03:49 PM
The problem is that china and russia will not put cap and trade legislation into effect so the additional costs of energy and producing emissions cannot be passed on to the consumer crippling the US steel industry and laying off workers for one of the few manufacturing industries left here.
Exactly, but the B.O. misadministration doesn't get it.
I think they do Lars. They need higher unemployment to increase the need for social programs.
It's very easy for me to believe what you say. I hoped B.O.'s radical ties were just part of playing politics in Illinois, but it appears he does have radical core beliefs.
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Mr Gray Jul 15 2009, 11:47 AM Post #20
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boilergrad01
Jul 15 2009, 09:41 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 15 2009, 09:20 AM
gallopingboiler
Jul 13 2009, 03:49 PM
The problem is that china and russia will not put cap and trade legislation into effect so the additional costs of energy and producing emissions cannot be passed on to the consumer crippling the US steel industry and laying off workers for one of the few manufacturing industries left here.
Exactly, but the B.O. misadministration doesn't get it.
I think they do Lars. They need higher unemployment to increase the need for social programs.
that belief is becoming much less "radical" as I am hearing it from several commentators and news people who normally wouldn't touch something like that.
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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