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DC Blindly defends Purdue Coaches; more accurate title
Tweet Topic Started: Sep 28 2009, 10:39 AM (1,340 Views)
dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:01 PM Post #16
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Bobobinc
Sep 28 2009, 12:39 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 10:57 AM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 10:48 AM
I agree it has only been 4 games. He has Purdue playing with spirit but also has made numerous mistakes and allowed the team to play with a complete lack of discipline. Punching a NIU player is unacceptable jumping offsides on key downs is unacceptable, taunting after a big stop is unacceptable, that timeout was unacceptable.

Motivation and competitiveness a plus

Self control and decision making a big fat F

The upside is there because it is easier to clean up the mistakes than to get a team to play with heart. Losing 3 games by a combined 12 points really enrages the emotional side of a fan.
At what point do you hold the players accountable? Hope has been the head coach for less than a year, he's not a miracle worker. I think there was a lot more to clean up within the program than people realize, and it doesn't happen over night.

I'm still not sure why people are so upset over the TO. I'd rather ND score with 30 seconds left and at least a chance to tie than to have them score on the last play of the game.

How did I know you would take that side of the argument on the TO.

I'd rather they didn't score, which would have been more likely without the TO.
So they wouldn't have run that same play on 4th down that scored the TD? It is what it is, I don't think the TO call changed the outcome of the game.

And I'm sure if he doesn't use the TO and we give up a TD while time is expiring people are upset that we ended the game with our full allotment of TOs at our disposal.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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Bobobinc Sep 28 2009, 01:18 PM Post #17
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dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:01 PM
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Sep 28 2009, 12:39 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 10:57 AM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 10:48 AM
I agree it has only been 4 games. He has Purdue playing with spirit but also has made numerous mistakes and allowed the team to play with a complete lack of discipline. Punching a NIU player is unacceptable jumping offsides on key downs is unacceptable, taunting after a big stop is unacceptable, that timeout was unacceptable.

Motivation and competitiveness a plus

Self control and decision making a big fat F

The upside is there because it is easier to clean up the mistakes than to get a team to play with heart. Losing 3 games by a combined 12 points really enrages the emotional side of a fan.
At what point do you hold the players accountable? Hope has been the head coach for less than a year, he's not a miracle worker. I think there was a lot more to clean up within the program than people realize, and it doesn't happen over night.

I'm still not sure why people are so upset over the TO. I'd rather ND score with 30 seconds left and at least a chance to tie than to have them score on the last play of the game.

How did I know you would take that side of the argument on the TO.

I'd rather they didn't score, which would have been more likely without the TO.
So they wouldn't have run that same play on 4th down that scored the TD? It is what it is, I don't think the TO call changed the outcome of the game.

And I'm sure if he doesn't use the TO and we give up a TD while time is expiring people are upset that we ended the game with our full allotment of TOs at our disposal.
Don't know if they would have run that play or not. Maybe they fumble the snap, throw a pick on third down.

You're a smart guy. You know the time to be calling TOs would have been earlier, after first down. If Hope was indeed trying to save time, he screwed that up too by not starting earlier.

As I've said other places, getting a kickoff with 25 seconds to go and converting a field goal happens rarely. Our best chance to win was to stop them.
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boilergrad01 Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM Post #18
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DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
Nothing beats an Astronaut
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Unbiased Sep 28 2009, 01:28 PM Post #19
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Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
ddums is a delusional and hopeless homer
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dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM Post #20
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Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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Unbiased Sep 28 2009, 01:38 PM Post #21
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Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM
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Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
wow just wow
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BoilerBasketball2008 Sep 28 2009, 01:38 PM Post #22
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dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
Actually they wouldn't have had two plays. ND was lining up to spike it before we called the time out. Spiking it would have made it fourth down and they would have had one play.
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"NC and SB wins let me sleep well at night" - Irishfan :loser:

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dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:41 PM Post #23
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Sep 28 2009, 01:38 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
Actually they wouldn't have had two plays. ND was lining up to spike it before we called the time out. Spiking it would have made it fourth down and they would have had one play.
I doubt they would have spiked it, and if you are Hope, you can't wait for that. You make a decision, and stick with it. How in the world could he have known that they were going to spike it there? He told the ref to call the TO before the 2nd down play.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:43 PM Post #24
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Hope's explanation, and it makes sense to me:



"You know, it was second-and-goal and they ran it. I was on the headset with Coach (Gary) Nord and any time you get down there, on first- or second-and-goal inside the 5-yard line, the probability of getting a touchdown is pretty good. ... I don't know what the statistics would say, but it's very significant, the chances that when you get down there, you're going to score.

"If that was going to be the case, we needed to get in a position to get a field goal to go into overtime or a touchdown to win. We couldn't do that if there wasn't any time left on the clock. I was on the headset with Coach Nord and said that if they threw a pass, one of two things would happen, that they might get a touchdown or they might throw an incompletion that would stop the clock. But if they ran the ball and it's not a touchdown, the clock's going to keep running, and I don't want to run out of time.

So I got the official's attention (and said) that if they ran the ball and it wasn't a touchdown, that I wanted to call a timeout as soon as I could to save as much time as I could on the clock. I don't have any reservation about that at all."
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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BoilerBasketball2008 Sep 28 2009, 01:44 PM Post #25
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dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:41 PM
BoilerBasketball2008
Sep 28 2009, 01:38 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
Actually they wouldn't have had two plays. ND was lining up to spike it before we called the time out. Spiking it would have made it fourth down and they would have had one play.
I doubt they would have spiked it, and if you are Hope, you can't wait for that. You make a decision, and stick with it. How in the world could he have known that they were going to spike it there? He told the ref to call the TO before the 2nd down play.
I'm not expecting omnipotence from Hope. But the fact remains they were lining up to spike it. They wouldn't have had "two plays regardless"

And if he was truly concerned about time, you start calling timeouts way before that, like everyone else has said.

The ONLY reason to call timeout when he did, is if you see that you have some huge matchup problem on defense and need a substitution, etc.
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"NC and SB wins let me sleep well at night" - Irishfan :loser:

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BoilerBasketball2008 Sep 28 2009, 01:46 PM Post #26
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Sep 28 2009, 01:43 PM
Hope's explanation, and it makes sense to me:



"You know, it was second-and-goal and they ran it. I was on the headset with Coach (Gary) Nord and any time you get down there, on first- or second-and-goal inside the 5-yard line, the probability of getting a touchdown is pretty good. ... I don't know what the statistics would say, but it's very significant, the chances that when you get down there, you're going to score.

"If that was going to be the case, we needed to get in a position to get a field goal to go into overtime or a touchdown to win. We couldn't do that if there wasn't any time left on the clock. I was on the headset with Coach Nord and said that if they threw a pass, one of two things would happen, that they might get a touchdown or they might throw an incompletion that would stop the clock. But if they ran the ball and it's not a touchdown, the clock's going to keep running, and I don't want to run out of time.

So I got the official's attention (and said) that if they ran the ball and it wasn't a touchdown, that I wanted to call a timeout as soon as I could to save as much time as I could on the clock. I don't have any reservation about that at all."
Once again, when you have available TOs, you don't START thinking about the clock with 30 secs left and them on the 5. If anything you start it right after they got the 3rd-and-17
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dreachon Sep 28 2009, 01:46 PM Post #27
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I didn't see the game so I may not be fully aware of what the TO issue is here.

My personal philosophy is that timeouts always favor the offense. It givs them time to pick the best possible play for whatever situation they are in. Defenses are always at a disadvantage because the offense knows what they are going to do and the defense is in a reactionary position.

When a team is scrambling down the field for a game winning drive, there is a bit of chaos on the offensive side of the ball as well. In my opinion, it's really the only time a defense is close to being on a level playing field. With 30secs to go and ND needing a touchdown, there is no way I would call timeout.
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BoilerBasketball2008 Sep 28 2009, 01:49 PM Post #28
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Sep 28 2009, 01:46 PM
I didn't see the game so I may not be fully aware of what the TO issue is here.

My personal philosophy is that timeouts always favor the offense. It givs them time to pick the best possible play for whatever situation they are in. Defenses are always at a disadvantage because the offense knows what they are going to do and the defense is in a reactionary position.

When a team is scrambling down the field for a game winning drive, there is a bit of chaos on the offensive side of the ball as well. In my opinion, it's really the only time a defense is close to being on a level playing field. With 30secs to go and ND needing a touchdown, there is no way I would call timeout.
You nailed it basically. At the point Hope finally decided "Hey, I should prolly save some time" The Irish were scrambling trying to score the TD with 30 secs left.

If you watched that fucking game, you would no the chances of Purdue getting within FG range in 30secs were pretty damn thin. Especially with ND in the prevent. It made no god damn sense to call the TO (unless he had previously been trying to save clock)
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dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:52 PM Post #29
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Sep 28 2009, 01:44 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:41 PM
BoilerBasketball2008
Sep 28 2009, 01:38 PM
dcamden03
Sep 28 2009, 01:35 PM
boilergrad01
Sep 28 2009, 01:26 PM
DC,

In your eyes has a Purdue Coach ever made a bad decision??????

I am a loyal Boiler but when the coaches make mistakes they need to be called out.
They have made plenty, I don't think calling the TO there was a bad choice there, and I don't really think it had much effect on the game. ND was going to get two plays out of it regardless, may as well save some time in case they do in fact score.
Actually they wouldn't have had two plays. ND was lining up to spike it before we called the time out. Spiking it would have made it fourth down and they would have had one play.
I doubt they would have spiked it, and if you are Hope, you can't wait for that. You make a decision, and stick with it. How in the world could he have known that they were going to spike it there? He told the ref to call the TO before the 2nd down play.
I'm not expecting omnipotence from Hope. But the fact remains they were lining up to spike it. They wouldn't have had "two plays regardless"

And if he was truly concerned about time, you start calling timeouts way before that, like everyone else has said.

The ONLY reason to call timeout when he did, is if you see that you have some huge matchup problem on defense and need a substitution, etc.
Purdue only had 2 TOs. Once its obvious that ND is going to score (inside the 5 with 2 plays to score), you use a TO to save time. Use one to save time, save the other for your offense. Seems pretty smart to me.

Like Hope said, once the running play was called, the TO was made. He made the decision to save time, and did the smart thing by letting the ref know so that the most time possible was saved. He couldn't predict the future that Weis was going to make a horrible decision by spiking the ball on 3rd down with 38 seconds left.

I don't think it was the difference in the game, and is a pretty non-event to me. The whole drive before that was pathetic, as was the two defensive play calls on the last two plays.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Sep 28 2009, 01:53 PM Post #30
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Monday Morning QBs FTW!!!! :sarcasm:
Edited by dçamden03, Sep 28 2009, 01:53 PM.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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