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Solving Problems
Tweet Topic Started: Dec 28 2010, 04:38 PM (982 Views)
BTown11 Dec 30 2010, 10:11 PM Post #61
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
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BTown11 Dec 30 2010, 10:14 PM Post #62
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It's amazing how fast some of you have turned on Crean. I don't expect to see you around when we're winning 20+.
Who turned on him? I am just speaking what I have observed. He doesn't have the personnel to run his type of offense and to play his type of defense. I am just a little critical of the fact that he doesn't seem to use the bench as a motivator for certain players but he has for a few and I see them respond. Also, I think he should implement a motion type offense that is centered around getting movement and high percentage shots. I see a lot of standing around, 3 man weave, and one-on-one type of play and he doesn't have people that can create their own shot. The best we have, lord help me on what I am about to say, is Verdell Jones, but he (also Watford) isn't strong wit the ball. Also, we don't have the personnel to play in your face defense, pressure the ball, and get deflections, which could turn into steals. He needs to employ something that will work for this team, what that is I have no idea. But don't say that some of us has turned on Crean because I haven't once this year said that. He just needs to make adjustments that is better suited for this team and get away from what he usually teaches.

I will be around when we win 20+ games.
If its not sunshine and lollipops, you are being a hater. Duh.
I agree DC. I have even heard Btown make some of the same statements as us, but then goes back the other way.

I haven't once slammed Crean this year. I have just stated some of the problems this team has.
i mean things aren't perfect, and this isn't fantasy island or something, but the last week of basketball isn't going to make me question the direction of this program at all whatsoever. i know the future is bright, i didn't expect a ton from this season, and i don't think this season is over either. we just need to ride the wave, but some of the stuff i've seen last week has just been absurd statements (and honestly, most of the craziness has come on ITH, Scout, Peegs, and Twitter).

the things that rub me the wrong way are people personally attacking college athletes who do the right things. i've done it to pritchard in the past, but i'm really striving to stop it. the kids on this years' team really do have the right things in mind and don't deserve to be called names by anyone, much less their own fanbase. that's just disgusting.
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crveech Dec 30 2010, 10:49 PM Post #63
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Dec 30 2010, 03:58 PM
It's amazing how fast some of you have turned on Crean. I don't expect to see you around when we're winning 20+.
Who turned on him? I am just speaking what I have observed. He doesn't have the personnel to run his type of offense and to play his type of defense. I am just a little critical of the fact that he doesn't seem to use the bench as a motivator for certain players but he has for a few and I see them respond. Also, I think he should implement a motion type offense that is centered around getting movement and high percentage shots. I see a lot of standing around, 3 man weave, and one-on-one type of play and he doesn't have people that can create their own shot. The best we have, lord help me on what I am about to say, is Verdell Jones, but he (also Watford) isn't strong wit the ball. Also, we don't have the personnel to play in your face defense, pressure the ball, and get deflections, which could turn into steals. He needs to employ something that will work for this team, what that is I have no idea. But don't say that some of us has turned on Crean because I haven't once this year said that. He just needs to make adjustments that is better suited for this team and get away from what he usually teaches.

I will be around when we win 20+ games.
If its not sunshine and lollipops, you are being a hater. Duh.
I agree DC. I have even heard Btown make some of the same statements as us, but then goes back the other way.

I haven't once slammed Crean this year. I have just stated some of the problems this team has.
i mean things aren't perfect, and this isn't fantasy island or something, but the last week of basketball isn't going to make me question the direction of this program at all whatsoever. i know the future is bright, i didn't expect a ton from this season, and i don't think this season is over either. we just need to ride the wave, but some of the stuff i've seen last week has just been absurd statements (and honestly, most of the craziness has come on ITH, Scout, Peegs, and Twitter).

the things that rub me the wrong way are people personally attacking college athletes who do the right things. i've done it to pritchard in the past, but i'm really striving to stop it. the kids on this years' team really do have the right things in mind and don't deserve to be called names by anyone, much less their own fanbase. that's just disgusting.
I agree that fanbases go over the line sometimes when treating college players. One example was when the Boise State kicker received threatening messages after missing those two FGs against Nevada. But fans have every right to talk down college players. You need to remember that these players are getting free rides to school just to play basketball because the coaching staff believes they can help them win. Also, fans pay to see them play. And they're not a bunch of little kids. They're young adults who should be able to take a some verbal abuse.
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blak_rob0 Dec 31 2010, 12:24 AM Post #64
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
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BTown11 Dec 31 2010, 01:15 AM Post #65
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
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blak_rob0 Dec 31 2010, 01:25 AM Post #66
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Dec 30 2010, 09:53 PM
Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
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BTown11 Dec 31 2010, 01:29 AM Post #67
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Dec 30 2010, 09:53 PM
Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
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blak_rob0 Dec 31 2010, 01:34 AM Post #68
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Dec 30 2010, 09:53 PM
Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
I've watched a couple. I'm basing my opinion mainly off other IU posters and stats that Verdell hasn't played up to par. If he really isn't turning the ball over around 4 times a game then I apologize.
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BTown11 Dec 31 2010, 01:37 AM Post #69
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Dec 30 2010, 09:53 PM
Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
I've watched a couple. I'm basing my opinion mainly off other IU posters and stats that Verdell hasn't played up to par. If he really isn't turning the ball over around 4 times a game then I apologize.
No, VJ hasn't played up to his normal capability with the exception of a few games, but his turnovers have come not from "dribbling with his head down" but rather trying to force action once a play breaks down. to me, that exposes a larger problem, not one with ball security. seems to me the root cause of turnovers are broken down sets.

last game he had one turnover, scored 15 points on 5-12 shooting but yet no one talked about him having a better game. i wasn't trying to be an ass asking if you if you had seen games, i was just pointing out that his turnovers aren't all carless ones, to me they just expose a larger problem.
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blak_rob0 Dec 31 2010, 01:42 AM Post #70
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
I've watched a couple. I'm basing my opinion mainly off other IU posters and stats that Verdell hasn't played up to par. If he really isn't turning the ball over around 4 times a game then I apologize.
No, VJ hasn't played up to his normal capability with the exception of a few games, but his turnovers have come not from "dribbling with his head down" but rather trying to force action once a play breaks down. to me, that exposes a larger problems, not one with ball security. seems to me the root cause of turnovers are broken down sets.

last game he had one turnover, scored 15 points on 5-12 shooting but yet no one talked about him having a better game. i wasn't trying to be an ass asking if you if you had seen games, i was just pointing out that his turnovers aren't all carless ones, to me they just expose a larger problem.
No offense taken. I just saw where I think dedicated said he couldn't dribble with his head up but yet put in a lot of time in the gym and those two things just don't add up. I kind of used him as an example for when fans overstate how hard guys work in the gym and I shouldn't of did that.

My personal opinion of VJ has always been pretty high mainly since he has seemed to always play well against Purdue. That being said he needs to find a way to keep the TOs down regardless of the reason to be a truly effective guard especially if he is being thrown into the PG position.
Edited by blak_rob0, Dec 31 2010, 01:45 AM.
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dedicatedIUfan Dec 31 2010, 10:15 AM Post #71
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
I've watched a couple. I'm basing my opinion mainly off other IU posters and stats that Verdell hasn't played up to par. If he really isn't turning the ball over around 4 times a game then I apologize.
No, VJ hasn't played up to his normal capability with the exception of a few games, but his turnovers have come not from "dribbling with his head down" but rather trying to force action once a play breaks down. to me, that exposes a larger problems, not one with ball security. seems to me the root cause of turnovers are broken down sets.

last game he had one turnover, scored 15 points on 5-12 shooting but yet no one talked about him having a better game. i wasn't trying to be an ass asking if you if you had seen games, i was just pointing out that his turnovers aren't all carless ones, to me they just expose a larger problem.
No offense taken. I just saw where I think dedicated said he couldn't dribble with his head up but yet put in a lot of time in the gym and those two things just don't add up. I kind of used him as an example for when fans overstate how hard guys work in the gym and I shouldn't of did that.

My personal opinion of VJ has always been pretty high mainly since he has seemed to always play well against Purdue. That being said he needs to find a way to keep the TOs down regardless of the reason to be a truly effective guard especially if he is being thrown into the PG position.
I think that was Evil that said something about dribbling with head down and I just eloborated about working hard in the gym. A lot of people have stated that he works hard, even DD stated that on his show. Said he was the hardest working player on the roster. I just think if a guy works that hard in the gym, there should a return on investment. A guy shouldn't go backwards and keep making the same dumb mistakes. He isn't strong with the ball when he drives and he does dribble with his head down. Also, some of his turnovers come from dumb passes, not just on drives or offensive breakdowns. I remember a bad pass in the post to Elston against Colorado and the next thing that happened after that was Elston got taken out. The pass was a very poor angle and if he were in better position to pass then he would have seen the second defender, who ended up stealing the ball, coming from the weak side. Those are examples of him not being skilled at that position. Also, if the guy was in the gym as much as everyone says, then why can't he shoot 3 pointers, free throws and handle the ball better than he has?
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blak_rob0 Dec 31 2010, 05:10 PM Post #72
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Some people have said that he works his ass off in the gym more than anyone, but I don't see it.
just because he isn't a leader on the floor doesn't mean he doesn't work his ass off. he really does, as does Creek. anywho, we just need someone who leads by example which just comes with time. everything comes with time.
I'm sure if you hung out around the IU boards and fans you would eventually hear that every player worked their ass of in the gym. It gets overstated a lot IMO. Also they might be in the gym a lot but not working on their skills correctly. I agree with dedicated that if a guy is in the gym so much he should atleast be able to look up while he is dribbling.
Actually I know some of the players fairly well, especially the old players (2007-2008) and they were definitely lazy sacks of shit. Verdell isn't even a natural point guard, he just is forced to play that role because we have an incomplete roster.
My point is that every fan base says all their players work extremely hard even though they don't really know. I'm not saying they all actually do but using the 07-08 IU guys is not a good measuring stick anyways. Natural point guard or not if he is a guard he should be able to dribble with his head up and not turn the ball over 4 times a game.
i'm sorry but have you been watching games?
I've watched a couple. I'm basing my opinion mainly off other IU posters and stats that Verdell hasn't played up to par. If he really isn't turning the ball over around 4 times a game then I apologize.
No, VJ hasn't played up to his normal capability with the exception of a few games, but his turnovers have come not from "dribbling with his head down" but rather trying to force action once a play breaks down. to me, that exposes a larger problems, not one with ball security. seems to me the root cause of turnovers are broken down sets.

last game he had one turnover, scored 15 points on 5-12 shooting but yet no one talked about him having a better game. i wasn't trying to be an ass asking if you if you had seen games, i was just pointing out that his turnovers aren't all carless ones, to me they just expose a larger problem.
No offense taken. I just saw where I think dedicated said he couldn't dribble with his head up but yet put in a lot of time in the gym and those two things just don't add up. I kind of used him as an example for when fans overstate how hard guys work in the gym and I shouldn't of did that.

My personal opinion of VJ has always been pretty high mainly since he has seemed to always play well against Purdue. That being said he needs to find a way to keep the TOs down regardless of the reason to be a truly effective guard especially if he is being thrown into the PG position.
I think that was Evil that said something about dribbling with head down and I just eloborated about working hard in the gym. A lot of people have stated that he works hard, even DD stated that on his show. Said he was the hardest working player on the roster. I just think if a guy works that hard in the gym, there should a return on investment. A guy shouldn't go backwards and keep making the same dumb mistakes. He isn't strong with the ball when he drives and he does dribble with his head down. Also, some of his turnovers come from dumb passes, not just on drives or offensive breakdowns. I remember a bad pass in the post to Elston against Colorado and the next thing that happened after that was Elston got taken out. The pass was a very poor angle and if he were in better position to pass then he would have seen the second defender, who ended up stealing the ball, coming from the weak side. Those are examples of him not being skilled at that position. Also, if the guy was in the gym as much as everyone says, then why can't he shoot 3 pointers, free throws and handle the ball better than he has?
I agree with your statement 100% but just had to step down to btown some because I haven't watched all of IU's games and I know I've never watched any of them as close as him so he knows why Jones is turning it over better than me. If he really is the hardest working player in the gym and your assessment is correct then something isn't adding up.
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Evilempire Dec 31 2010, 05:15 PM Post #73
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Btown is trying to dethrone the amazinghomer as IU's blindest homer. It's actually a little sad.
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brumdog44 Dec 31 2010, 06:04 PM Post #74
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The guy picked last in gym class
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Btown is trying to dethrone the amazinghomer as IU's blindest homer. It's actually a little sad.
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Evilempire Dec 31 2010, 06:37 PM Post #75
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brumdog44
Dec 31 2010, 06:04 PM
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Dec 31 2010, 05:15 PM
Btown is trying to dethrone the amazinghomer as IU's blindest homer. It's actually a little sad.
www.ourloboboard.com
Still hoping Guy will save the day.............
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