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Pujols vs. Fielder; Who's your man?
Tweet Topic Started: Aug 10 2011, 01:13 PM (944 Views)
obatskii Aug 10 2011, 03:19 PM Post #16
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dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 03:14 PM
It's not the most ridiculous question in the world.

1) Prince Fielder will come cheaper than Pujols. Pujols is looking at 10 years, 275-300 mil. I think Fielder gets a shorter contract and worth less. Something like 8 years and 200 mil. Think about this. The Yankees have to pay Arod 30mil/year for SIX more years. Any team not the Yankees that signs Pujols can't afford to be caught in the same situation or their whole franchise will suffer greatly.

2) Fielder can go to the AL. If you are an AL team, Fielder becomes a DH and he becomes much more effective later in his career. I don't think there is any chance Pujols goes to the AL. He is a ridiculously good 1st basemen and enjoys playing the field.

The question isn't who is the better player. Albert Pujols is a phenom. He's the best player in baseball and one of the top 5 of all time. He is a far and away a better player than Fielder. But if you are any team besides the Yanks or Sawx, you think long and hard before giving him the kind of contract that he is worth.
Thank you!!!

I never asked who was a better player or who has had a better career.

It will be very interesting to see what type of contracts they get. I really don't think St. Louis can afford to give Pujols a 10-year deal, especially with players like Wainwright, Carpenter, and Holliday but we will see. They're going to be in a tricky position. Do you sign him regardless of the price because of what he's meant to your franchise....or do you only do it if it's smart and take a chance on him walking and the potential fan backlash?
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dreachon Aug 10 2011, 03:25 PM Post #17
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I have said this from day 1.

There is no way Pujols doesn't return to St. Louis
Look for Carp not be resigned with the team. Holliday is already locked up long term. There's a youth movement in St. Louis with guys like Jon Jay and Allen Craig so they'll have a little room to play as vets get shown the door. In the end I think Pujols gives the Cards a hometown discount and the contract ends up around 27.5 mil/year
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obatskii Aug 10 2011, 03:36 PM Post #18
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Anything over 5-6 years and I think it's a terrible idea for St. Louis. I'm not sure he'll even get the 27.5 if it's a long deal. They have awesome fans, but they aren't a large market team. Cowherd has talked on several occasions before (and had analysts talking about it as well) that they just don't have the corporate money like some of the large market teams have. If they give him something silly like 30 million long-term and he doesn't produce, it could be crippling for their franchise.

I think 5 years at 150 million is fair for both sides. Reports in the spring were that the negotiations stalled over the length of the contract, not the yearly salary. I'm sure I'll be glad when he signs so I don't have to hear about it every day, but it's going to be an interesting ride this winter.
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dçamden03 Aug 10 2011, 03:48 PM Post #19
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One bad year, in which he was injured, and now he's on the decline. He's only 31. He's got at least 5-6 great years left, and probably some just good years after that.

Knee-jerk reactions to one season are why GMs get fired, especially when that career year happens to come in a contract year.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Aug 10 2011, 03:54 PM Post #20
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Oh yeah, and that bad year is probably going to be a .280/.345/.531 season with 30+ HRs and 100+ RBIs.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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obatskii Aug 10 2011, 03:54 PM Post #21
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dçamden03
Aug 10 2011, 03:48 PM
One bad year, in which he was injured, and now he's on the decline. He's only 31. He's got at least 5-6 great years left, and probably some just good years after that.

Knee-jerk reactions to one season are why GMs get fired, especially when that career year happens to come in a contract year.
I don't care how good of a career he's had, paying a 37-year-old athlete 30 million a year is not smart business.
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dçamden03 Aug 10 2011, 03:59 PM Post #22
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obatskii
Aug 10 2011, 03:54 PM
dçamden03
Aug 10 2011, 03:48 PM
One bad year, in which he was injured, and now he's on the decline. He's only 31. He's got at least 5-6 great years left, and probably some just good years after that.

Knee-jerk reactions to one season are why GMs get fired, especially when that career year happens to come in a contract year.
I don't care how good of a career he's had, paying a 37-year-old athlete 30 million a year is not smart business.
When you get his elite years from ages 31-35, it can be. Losing Pujols now would be catastrophic to the Cards, and getting Pujols now could be huge for some teams.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dçamden03 Aug 10 2011, 04:15 PM Post #23
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And any contract Pujols signed would probably be front loaded. Look at A-Rod's contract, he'll only be making $20 million at the end.
“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves."

"I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel

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dreachon Aug 10 2011, 05:36 PM Post #24
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obatskii
Aug 10 2011, 03:36 PM
Anything over 5-6 years and I think it's a terrible idea for St. Louis. I'm not sure he'll even get the 27.5 if it's a long deal. They have awesome fans, but they aren't a large market team. Cowherd has talked on several occasions before (and had analysts talking about it as well) that they just don't have the corporate money like some of the large market teams have. If they give him something silly like 30 million long-term and he doesn't produce, it could be crippling for their franchise.

I think 5 years at 150 million is fair for both sides. Reports in the spring were that the negotiations stalled over the length of the contract, not the yearly salary. I'm sure I'll be glad when he signs so I don't have to hear about it every day, but it's going to be an interesting ride this winter.
Oh he's gonna get way more than a 5 year contract. No doubt about it. This next contract will be his last.
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Mr Gray Aug 10 2011, 05:47 PM Post #25
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dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 03:14 PM
Albert Pujols is a phenom. He's the best player in baseball and one of the top 5 of all time.
Whoa....easy there trigger, top 5 of all time?
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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Mr Gray Aug 10 2011, 05:47 PM Post #26
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dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 03:25 PM
I have said this from day 1.

There is no way Pujols doesn't return to St. Louis
LOL, says the man who started the "funniest rumor ever" thread. :D
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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obatskii Aug 10 2011, 05:54 PM Post #27
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dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 05:36 PM
obatskii
Aug 10 2011, 03:36 PM
Anything over 5-6 years and I think it's a terrible idea for St. Louis. I'm not sure he'll even get the 27.5 if it's a long deal. They have awesome fans, but they aren't a large market team. Cowherd has talked on several occasions before (and had analysts talking about it as well) that they just don't have the corporate money like some of the large market teams have. If they give him something silly like 30 million long-term and he doesn't produce, it could be crippling for their franchise.

I think 5 years at 150 million is fair for both sides. Reports in the spring were that the negotiations stalled over the length of the contract, not the yearly salary. I'm sure I'll be glad when he signs so I don't have to hear about it every day, but it's going to be an interesting ride this winter.
Oh he's gonna get way more than a 5 year contract. No doubt about it. This next contract will be his last.
I'm not disagreeing with that, but if I'm just saying if someone gives him 10 years at big bucks they're stupid as hell. Power hitters aren't power hitters when they're 40. Like you said, if it's a big market team, then they'll be able to absorb a contract like that regardless, but certain teams could be putting themselves behind the proverbial 8-ball by doing so.

I'm obviously not a Cards fan, but I can't wait to see how this plays out. I think it will be quite fascinating.
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dreachon Aug 10 2011, 06:08 PM Post #28
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Mr Gray
Aug 10 2011, 05:47 PM
dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 03:25 PM
I have said this from day 1.

There is no way Pujols doesn't return to St. Louis
LOL, says the man who started the "funniest rumor ever" thread. :D
Haha. And I was right on that thread too, wasn't I? Pujols ain't leavin.
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dreachon Aug 10 2011, 06:09 PM Post #29
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Aug 10 2011, 05:47 PM
dreachon
Aug 10 2011, 03:14 PM
Albert Pujols is a phenom. He's the best player in baseball and one of the top 5 of all time.
Whoa....easy there trigger, top 5 of all time?
When all is said and done, yer gonna have people arguing he is THE best of all time. Watch him now, cuz you'll be telling yer grandkids about him later.
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obatskii Aug 10 2011, 06:38 PM Post #30
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You move to Alabama? Haha
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