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IU vs. Michigan; Game Thread
Tweet Topic Started: Jan 5 2012, 08:44 PM (1,905 Views)
obatskii Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM Post #316
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Go Tebow!
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Rockspeed
Jan 6 2012, 12:04 AM
obatskii
Jan 5 2012, 11:54 PM
BTown11
Jan 5 2012, 11:45 PM
You'd think the last 3 years would have given some people perspective but instead the last 4 weeks have just made some greedier.

We just beat a top 15 team, without our sixth man, and moved to 14-1. What's done is done.

Oh,

WE WON!
Amen, brother, amen!

First off, I doubt the box score lied about how many TOs he committed. In Verdell perfect? Hell no! But he's much better than the other options we currently have. He makes bad decisions, but he also makes a ton of big plays. When he does so, it seems to get dismissed, but when he fucks up, everyone and their mother wants to jump his ass. Honestly, that pisses me off. He's been here through thick and thin, and the amount of disrespect he gets is asinine.

And what about his defense this year? He has improved a ridiculous amount, yet no one wants to talk about that. Hulls' defense is just as bad as Verdell's TOs if not worse yet there's hardly a peep made about that.

We are 14-1 (already more wins than last year including 3 huge home wins), yet all some of you want to do is bag on our Senior leader for making some TOs. I have no problem with bringing it up, but to only bring up his negatives bothers me.

That is all.
not only the negative was brought up... I said, "He shoots the ball well"... SOMETIMES he's successful at creating a shot but really, if he spots up and shoots... he's best there... oh, and he sits on the bench well... That being said, Hulls is the leader... Not Jones. When you listen to the team talk about leadership, they'll talk about Hulls.

As far as TOs... they wont count bee line pass to Zeller under the basket when Zeller when it should have been a lob... that then counted as a TO to Zeller.. and Im only using that as an example...

and here through the thick and thin? appreciative? yes. Like him handling the ball? no If time spent on a team, even through the chaos we've been through, means you automatically get props as a good player and are no longer held accountable to making bad decisions during a game then there is something wrong with that philosophy.

When he makes a great play, I'll cheer him but the ratio of great plays to bad decisions is clearly in favor of his bad decisions. If we win the championship this year and Jones hits a Keith Smart jumper for the win, I'll praise his shot at that moment and be thrilled BUT that will not make him a great player. I will say this... if he hits a game winner for the NC, I will stop verbally beating him up. deal?
We're not winning the NC.

I have no problem with people ripping on him. It just infuriates me how dismissive we are about all the good things he does. Like Brum said, he did an admirable job on Burke yet that's hardly mentioned. His improved defense is one of the most noticeable improvements I see from last year.

I wasn't calling you out individually either, Rock. There are many people my thoughts apply to.

At the end of the day, it's just my opinion that he deserves more respect like it's yours that he doesn't.

One thing we can all agree on; being 14-1 feels really good.
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"They say it takes a village to raise a family. Well, it took a nation to rebuild a program. THANK YOU HOOSIER NATION!" -Tom Crean

Proud Swiftie
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tAmazingHoosier Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM Post #317
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Let's just say after this season, we'll only lose about 10-15% of our scoring, and about 80% of our turnovers..
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indy_83 Jan 6 2012, 12:13 AM Post #318
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Jan 5 2012, 11:37 PM
indy_83
Jan 5 2012, 11:03 PM
Could really use Sheehey right now
If Sheehey was in the game, then maybe Jones would be on the bench at the end of games. ;)
If Sheehey had played, i doubt we need that shot at the end of the game. Jones drives me crazy along with every one else, but I am thankful that he came to IU and has put the effort that he has put over the past few years and didn't give up. Without the senior class we couldn't be where we are right now.
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IU1fan Jan 6 2012, 12:14 AM Post #319
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indy_83
Jan 6 2012, 12:13 AM
dedicatedIUfan
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indy_83
Jan 5 2012, 11:03 PM
Could really use Sheehey right now
If Sheehey was in the game, then maybe Jones would be on the bench at the end of games. ;)
If Sheehey had played, i doubt we need that shot at the end of the game. Jones drives me crazy along with every one else, but I am thankful that he came to IU and has put the effort that he has put over the past few years and didn't give up. Without the senior class we couldn't be where we are right now.
Amen, well said.
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Rockspeed Jan 6 2012, 12:19 AM Post #320
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IU1fan
Jan 6 2012, 12:14 AM
indy_83
Jan 6 2012, 12:13 AM
dedicatedIUfan
Jan 5 2012, 11:37 PM
indy_83
Jan 5 2012, 11:03 PM
Could really use Sheehey right now
If Sheehey was in the game, then maybe Jones would be on the bench at the end of games. ;)
If Sheehey had played, i doubt we need that shot at the end of the game. Jones drives me crazy along with every one else, but I am thankful that he came to IU and has put the effort that he has put over the past few years and didn't give up. Without the senior class we couldn't be where we are right now.
Amen, well said.
This deserves a drink :cheers:

I say we all hug and make up and get ready for the PSU game! GO HOOSIERS!
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crveech Jan 6 2012, 12:23 AM Post #321
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Hoosier Daddy?!
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Let's all remember that our best bench player is still hurt, yet we've been able to pull out two wins against ranked teams at home. Let's just all be happy with the win and move on to Penn State. They won't be as easy as we all thought after they embarrassing Purdue tonight.
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IUCOLTFAN Jan 6 2012, 12:53 AM Post #322
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The dumbest quote of the night goes to Dakich when referring to Hardaway stepping back off a screen to hit a jumper......he said, "thats what they call chin action"


Can anyone honestly tell me wtf that even means?
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panchen_lama Jan 6 2012, 12:54 AM Post #323
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well...frustrating as people have said. but, some of my takeaways...

1) watford still has his games and stretches where he seems to disappear, but luv seeing him emotionally engaged and understanding his potential and role. huge expectations for his senior year.
2) did VO have the flu? just was not himself. did not look it and his game seemed to be a bit stagnant (for him).
3) roth with the head fake on the three and pull-up two. lovely.
4) more remy!!! kid has no fear. he's a difference maker. my biggest worry is he will be pushed out with other talent coming in. but, the kid just seems a competitor who hates losing.
5) been said a million times...sheehey needs to get back.
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brumdog44 Jan 6 2012, 01:05 AM Post #324
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tAmazingHoosier
Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM
Let's just say after this season, we'll only lose about 10-15% of our scoring, and about 80% of our turnovers..
Yeah, I'm sure next year we'll be averaging 3 turnovers per game.

Hulls had played piss poor in two of the last three games, but all we'll hear about is the VJ hate. VJ definitely made some bad plays tonight....but can you name me one good play that Jordan made? Funny that no one has yet to mention Jones' 6 assists. And while Hulls may be a leader, I saw him shirk that responsibility tonight when he the ball with the clock running down and passed it. Where did the ball end up? In Verdell's hands.

No one has ever called Jones a great player, so stop that line of argument. But VO went 2 of 10 from the field, Zeller only had 4 rebounds, and Hulls did nothing. If you want to dissect everything Jones does, then you have to look at everybody.
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Rockspeed Jan 6 2012, 01:23 AM Post #325
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Jan 6 2012, 01:05 AM
tAmazingHoosier
Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM
Let's just say after this season, we'll only lose about 10-15% of our scoring, and about 80% of our turnovers..
Yeah, I'm sure next year we'll be averaging 3 turnovers per game.

Hulls had played piss poor in two of the last three games, but all we'll hear about is the VJ hate. VJ definitely made some bad plays tonight....but can you name me one good play that Jordan made? Funny that no one has yet to mention Jones' 6 assists. And while Hulls may be a leader, I saw him shirk that responsibility tonight when he the ball with the clock running down and passed it. Where did the ball end up? In Verdell's hands.

No one has ever called Jones a great player, so stop that line of argument. But VO went 2 of 10 from the field, Zeller only had 4 rebounds, and Hulls did nothing. If you want to dissect everything Jones does, then you have to look at everybody.
When Jones has a good game, you wont hear about a lot of his mistakes... You have to ask yourself why he's such a lightning rod for criticism and the most likely reason is, he makes bad decisions AND plays out of control CONSISTENTLY. Yes he has his games where he may put up 15-20 pts and Hulls has his bad games but when you look at the consistency of all of the players, Jones stands out as one that makes bad decisions and plays sloppy. The same can be said for Pritchard as well. Both on OHB and through random chat with other IU fans, people have a tendency to cringe when Jones is handling the ball or when Pritchard gets in the game. I agree that he needs to hold a special place in our hearts because he's endured the hardships at IU BUT that doesnt mean that he always needs to hold a place on the court at the end of the game.
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panchen_lama Jan 6 2012, 01:28 AM Post #326
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Rockspeed
Jan 6 2012, 01:23 AM
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Jan 6 2012, 01:05 AM
tAmazingHoosier
Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM
Let's just say after this season, we'll only lose about 10-15% of our scoring, and about 80% of our turnovers..
Yeah, I'm sure next year we'll be averaging 3 turnovers per game.

Hulls had played piss poor in two of the last three games, but all we'll hear about is the VJ hate. VJ definitely made some bad plays tonight....but can you name me one good play that Jordan made? Funny that no one has yet to mention Jones' 6 assists. And while Hulls may be a leader, I saw him shirk that responsibility tonight when he the ball with the clock running down and passed it. Where did the ball end up? In Verdell's hands.

No one has ever called Jones a great player, so stop that line of argument. But VO went 2 of 10 from the field, Zeller only had 4 rebounds, and Hulls did nothing. If you want to dissect everything Jones does, then you have to look at everybody.
When Jones has a good game, you wont hear about a lot of his mistakes... You have to ask yourself why he's such a lightning rod for criticism and the most likely reason is, he makes bad decisions AND plays out of control CONSISTENTLY. Yes he has his games where he may put up 15-20 pts and Hulls has his bad games but when you look at the consistency of all of the players, Jones stands out as one that makes bad decisions and plays sloppy. The same can be said for Pritchard as well. Both on OHB and through random chat with other IU fans, people have a tendency to cringe when Jones is handling the ball or when Pritchard gets in the game. I agree that he needs to hold a special place in our hearts because he's endured the hardships at IU BUT that doesnt mean that he always needs to hold a place on the court at the end of the game.
cue yogi licking his chops...
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brumdog44 Jan 6 2012, 01:32 AM Post #327
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Jan 6 2012, 01:23 AM
brumdog44
Jan 6 2012, 01:05 AM
tAmazingHoosier
Jan 6 2012, 12:11 AM
Let's just say after this season, we'll only lose about 10-15% of our scoring, and about 80% of our turnovers..
Yeah, I'm sure next year we'll be averaging 3 turnovers per game.

Hulls had played piss poor in two of the last three games, but all we'll hear about is the VJ hate. VJ definitely made some bad plays tonight....but can you name me one good play that Jordan made? Funny that no one has yet to mention Jones' 6 assists. And while Hulls may be a leader, I saw him shirk that responsibility tonight when he the ball with the clock running down and passed it. Where did the ball end up? In Verdell's hands.

No one has ever called Jones a great player, so stop that line of argument. But VO went 2 of 10 from the field, Zeller only had 4 rebounds, and Hulls did nothing. If you want to dissect everything Jones does, then you have to look at everybody.
When Jones has a good game, you wont hear about a lot of his mistakes... You have to ask yourself why he's such a lightning rod for criticism and the most likely reason is, he makes bad decisions AND plays out of control CONSISTENTLY. Yes he has his games where he may put up 15-20 pts and Hulls has his bad games but when you look at the consistency of all of the players, Jones stands out as one that makes bad decisions and plays sloppy. The same can be said for Pritchard as well. Both on OHB and through random chat with other IU fans, people have a tendency to cringe when Jones is handling the ball or when Pritchard gets in the game. I agree that he needs to hold a special place in our hearts because he's endured the hardships at IU BUT that doesnt mean that he always needs to hold a place on the court at the end of the game.
Can you enlighten me on how consistent Hulls has been in Big Ten play?

And I would like to add, once again, that in our three wins against ranked opponents Jones has had the assist of the game winning bucket or hit the most important shot of the game. That doesn't make him great, but he is one the five best players on the team, especially when Sheehey is out.
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BTown11 Jan 6 2012, 01:33 AM Post #328
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Jones seems to be the only guard that legitimately tries to get the ball in the post, too. I love Jordan Hulls but his no-show games kill us especially since he can't defend penetrating point guards.
Death to Signatures.
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panchen_lama Jan 6 2012, 01:40 AM Post #329
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BTown11
Jan 6 2012, 01:33 AM
Jones seems to be the only guard that legitimately tries to get the ball in the post, too. I love Jordan Hulls but his no-show games kill us especially since he can't defend penetrating point guards.
i agree with this. but jones also tries to force it too much into the post, when an extra pass or couple dribble could open up a better angle. and, don't see jones consistently guarding penetrating point guards either.

jones has an important role on this team...but i would like to see some other bodies given more of a chance. feel it will ultimately benefit us come march...
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panchen_lama Jan 6 2012, 01:40 AM Post #330
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BTown11
Jan 6 2012, 01:33 AM
Jones seems to be the only guard that legitimately tries to get the ball in the post, too. I love Jordan Hulls but his no-show games kill us especially since he can't defend penetrating point guards.
i agree with this. but jones also tries to force it too much into the post, when an extra pass or couple dribble could open up a better angle. and, don't see jones consistently guarding penetrating point guards either.

jones has an important role on this team...but i would like to see some other bodies given more of a chance. feel it will ultimately benefit us come march...
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