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| VJIII Debate | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jan 13 2012, 09:42 PM (299 Views) | |
| MsJazen | Jan 14 2012, 03:21 AM Post #16 |
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Assistant Coach
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Verdell Jones is the most frustrating player to me just because I sit on my sofa, feeling that he should know better, should do better, every time I see him play...maybe it is me..I love the guy, I just wish he would have his head with him every now and then. :'( |
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| tAmazingHoosier | Jan 14 2012, 04:53 AM Post #17 |
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Coach
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2 things: 1) Why is Sheehey a "major contributor" playing less games than any of our starters? And everyone else in the latter categories? (Up to date?) 2.) Look at Verdells fucking T.O. rating. PATHETIC. You're a Senior. At some point.... you've got to EARN your PT. This season. Not last season, or the 2 before it. |
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| dçamden03 | Jan 14 2012, 05:03 AM Post #18 |
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Coach
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When Sheehey is in the game, he is involved in more possessions than anyone else on the team. |
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“He’s always been a guy — maybe to a fault — he would always try to do what I said. That seems like something simple in coaching, but those are the guys I hang my hat on. We’ve had some guys in our program, we had a couple guys that felt I had a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. And they were right — I do have a bias towards E’Twaun Moore. I like guys that go to class, that are academic All-Americans, that come early, that stay late, that love the game of basketball. I am biased towards those guys. And I’m biased towards Rob Hummel. But I’m also biased towards their habits, their work ethic, and how they carry themselves." "I’d take him to the ends of the earth — I’d want him playing for me.” - Bo Ryan on Robbie Hummel
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| Rockspeed | Jan 14 2012, 06:12 AM Post #19 |
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Coach
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Im not a BIG VJ fan at all and drives myself, and my wife, NUTS during the game! ugh... That being said, during senior day, although I wont be there, I HOPE the crowd applauds this guy and the rest of the seniors. I think this year is the passing of the baton from our recent past to our most anticipated future in Indiana lore. This year has been so exciting to watch... I just wish I were in Bloomington, and not in Germany, while this was happening! I LOVE THIS TEAM WE HAVE THIS YEAR but that doesn't mean I HAVE to like the individual players play and VJIII happens to be one of those that I wish he'd straighten up his game and go out on a high note. GO HOOSIERS! |
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| dedicatedIUfan | Jan 14 2012, 09:50 AM Post #20 |
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Coach
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Well said Rockspeed. I would like to see CTC go with this starting lineup: Zeller Watford Sheehey VO Hulls Bring in VJ off the bench along with Roth, Remy, Elston, and Pritcahard. |
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| dedicatedIUfan | Jan 14 2012, 09:57 AM Post #21 |
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Coach
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I think VJ is a D1 player too, but not in the Big Ten. Maybe at Ball State, Miami of Ohio, Illinois St., Bradley, or some other mid Major lower than Butler. The guy is a senior and he shouldn't be making the same mistakes that he has done since he was a freshman. That is the real frustrating thing about him. |
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| hoosier64 | Jan 14 2012, 10:46 AM Post #22 |
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OldSchool
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VJIII always faulters at the most critilal stages of the game! Always seems to be when the other team turns up the intensity, when making a run, he can never seem to match the intensity. Look at VO, he can make turnovers, but it always seems to flip this switch in him to turn it on. VJIII is a week spot regardless as to what some numbers may say! |
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| timpickett22 | Jan 14 2012, 12:54 PM Post #23 |
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The Drunken Master
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:facepalm: |
![]() Come and join in song together, shout with might and main. Our beloved Alma Mater, sound her praise again. Gloriana Frangipana, E'er to her be true. She's the pride of Indiana, Hail to Old IU! 2015 PC Stellar Big Ten Tournament Champion | |
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| tkeena33 | Jan 14 2012, 01:38 PM Post #24 |
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Assistant Coach
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I don't even mind Verdell starting, especially now with Sheehey coming off an injury. I'm sure he doesn't want Sheehey starting and playing 25+ minutes yet. I think Sheehey is a better player, but he's also been effective coming off the bench and often provides an instant spark. As someone said earlier, I do have a problem with Crean playing him for 23 minutes, including crucial moments down the stretch, in a game where he is 0-6 and not contributing anything on either end. If he starts, is playing under control, and making some shots, I have no problem with him playing 25 minutes. As a fan, I could just see that it wasn't his night and was not going to be his night. We would have been better served with Abell in there. Last year I thought Jones was selfish and just wanted his points. This year, I'm not getting the same vibe, but I think that when our offense struggles, he wants to step up and be the go-to-guy. With as much talent on our team, I just don't think that's our best option. But even so, last game I had no problem with him shooting open, controlled pull up jumpers. That's his game, and if he doesn't shoot it when it's there, he really would serve no purpose. On another note, I also hated Crean leaving Hulls in on defense late in the game. He was clearly subbing in offense and defense, so why leave Hulls in? He is our slowest, worst perimeter defender. We were pressuring them on the inbounds and they were having some trouble getting the ball in. Then he left Hulls in and he gave his guy a four foot cushion for an easy, uncontested inbound. And he fouled out to boot. If we did tie the game, we were going to be without our PG and our hot hand down the stretch. |
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| jdm3 | Jan 14 2012, 01:51 PM Post #25 |
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Senior
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I've never been a fan of the VJ hate. Sure he turns the ball over, sometimes at important points in the game. Sure his shot selection isn't always great...and even if it isn't I'm not going to be mad at a guard for taking an open look. However, at the end of the day VJ has been a very reliable on ball defender this year...arguably our 3rd maybe even 2nd best in that regard. He's been doing a much better job playing the passing lanes this year and seems like he's been getting his hands on a lot of pass which is extremely valuable. If we want to talk about liability on that end look t Jordan Hulls. I'm sorry but he can guard nobody. Absolutely nobody. It's awful. And he is public enemy no. 1 when it comes to going under screens. VJ does it too, he has his headaches on D sometimes, so does VO. It happens. But VJ is reliable on defense. Now offense, yea...turnovers..those suck. His shots arent always acceptable either. But he is our best ball handler, a 6'5 wing...that has to often play point because thats how the roster is. I don't fault him. His shot attempts are almost half as what they usually were, he's really accepted his role. You gotta take the good with the bad with a lot of players...he's one of them. Leads the team in assists, and he's not even the primary PG and he gets to the foul line more than anyone not named Zeller. I don't think you can call a guy selfish when he leads the team assists. Especially when he's not even primary PG. He's the only one that ever seems to try and sneak a pass to Zeller off a screen...sometimes its a bad choice, others its a dunk. I'd often rather that happen the Hulls pick up his dribble and throw it back out so we can reset and take a bad shot with the clock expiring...at least Jones tries to create, and is not afraid to make mistakes. What i'm getting at is why is Jones the scapegoat? He does so many things well. He leads the team in TO's too. Okay. VO is a great defender. VO turns the ball over, takes dumb jumpers, has no IQ on offense and can't make FT's. Everyone likes him. Hulls...to me, has this "golden boy" treatment that i've never understood from fans. Must be a Bloomington thing. But honestly, when he's not making shots, what is he really doing?? Nothing. Giving up points and not making mistakes with the ball, but not doing anything either. Though I will say he is possibly the worst player in the country at feeding the post. I've never seen a play get so many entry passes stolen. But back to my point, he can't play D and does not create, thats why we NEED VJ. If Sheehey played for him the offense would be even more stagnant. Too much 1 on 1 and 0 movement ever. I don't claim VJ to be an outstanding guard, but I will say he has very much overachieved as a player and has represented IU in the best way during the worst years in program history. And he's still a valuable player. It's pathetic to rip a guy like this fan base does. No player should be booed, especially a 4 year player that his given everything to IU and has been a pretty big part in the vast majority of all IU wins the past 4 seasons. |
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| tAmazingHoosier | Jan 14 2012, 02:29 PM Post #26 |
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Coach
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I don't see our offense becoming stagnant because of Will Sheehey. That's somewhat of a ridiculous statement my man. When Will's in the game, we make our runs. Fact. Also, I wouldn't put Verdells on-ball defense over VO, Will, or Daniel Moore, and quite possibly not even before Watford (who has much improved in that regard). 'Dell straight looks lost out there on defense at times. I've lost count at how many times we've seen Verdell get turned around, trying to run and catch up as if he is completely lost. That's just frustrating from a senior. |
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| brumdog44 | Jan 14 2012, 02:35 PM Post #27 |
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The guy picked last in gym class
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+1000. He's averaging the fewer minutes he has in four years. He is putting up six shots per game after never putting up less than 8 shots per game, yet people say he has a 'I've got to get mine' personality. His defense has improved dramatically, but thanks for not noticing. For those of you saying he is playing 'selfish', here are the shots/40 minutes of players on our team: Sheehey: 14.9 Watford: 13.5 Oladipo: 13.4 Zeller: 11.9 Elston: 11.5 Hulls: 10.5 Abell: 10.4 Jones: 9.5 Roth: 8.8 And just so everyone is paying attention: Verdell Jones has a played a season high 34 minutes in three games. Those games? Kentucky, Ohio State, and Michigan. If he is soooo freaking horrible, then how is it that we could win with him on the court for 34 minutes against the #1 and #2 teams? It is my opinion that he shouldn't be starting and would be best served coming off the bench as a sixth man, but the suggestions of basically burying him on the bench, him not being a D1 player are ludicrous. Also, tamazing, I cross referenced the website (www.stuffimadeup.com) where you saw Oladipo had 4 steals and 25 deflections the last two games and it said Jones had 18 steals and 42 deflections during that time. |
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| dreachon | Jan 14 2012, 02:40 PM Post #28 |
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Creative Title Here
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Haha. TAmazings "facts" come straight out of nowhere with no backup whatsoever. |
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| tAmazingHoosier | Jan 14 2012, 02:44 PM Post #29 |
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Coach
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I never said it was a fact you fools. When someone says "like" something, that doesn't mean exactly. Nice comprehension skills, teacher. Don't get all butt hurt because I don't write stats down during the game. Bottom line: VO is by FAR our best defender. You guys are going to look silly trying to prove otherwise. Good luck. |
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| tAmazingHoosier | Jan 14 2012, 02:49 PM Post #30 |
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Coach
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Never said it was a fact. Read it again... definitely sounds like a rough estimate. SMD. |
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