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Minimum Wage; ..for your consumption
Tweet Topic Started: Jul 16 2013, 01:14 PM (1,716 Views)
HoosierLars Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM Post #181
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eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
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eelbor Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM Post #182
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Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
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HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Posted Image

"Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed


Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder.
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brumdog44 Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM Post #183
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aaron, I'm talking about the fact that most workers at McDonald's aren't able to get 40 hours there. That hasn't nothing to do with hourly wage, but it does have everything to do with the idea that these workers are just 'lazy' and 'should be able to get by on minimum wage'.
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brumdog44 Jul 22 2013, 04:08 PM Post #184
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eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
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Mr Gray Jul 22 2013, 04:14 PM Post #185
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brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
aaron, I'm talking about the fact that most workers at McDonald's aren't able to get 40 hours there. That hasn't nothing to do with hourly wage, but it does have everything to do with the idea that these workers are just 'lazy' and 'should be able to get by on minimum wage'.
I don't know if they are lazy or not, but if we aren't talking about full time employment, then this conversation is just silly....I'll go on the record and say no...people most likely can't survive on their own working part time at McDonalds....and if anyone on here believes they should, please let me know why.
Posted Image
The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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Mr Gray Jul 22 2013, 04:15 PM Post #186
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Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
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Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
or they could figure out how to rely on themselves instead of the government or their employer via government regulation and no longer be poor.
Posted Image
The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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HoosierLars Jul 22 2013, 04:26 PM Post #187
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brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:08 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
Brum, I apologize if I missed your answer, as I haven't been following this forum closely, but do you think US companies have an obligation to pay US workers $9/hr when then can find 3rd world employees to work for much less and do comparable work? Also, should US companies be obligated to provide health care for those 3rd world employees?
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eelbor Jul 22 2013, 04:46 PM Post #188
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HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 04:26 PM
brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:08 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
Brum, I apologize if I missed your answer, as I haven't been following this forum closely, but do you think US companies have an obligation to pay US workers $9/hr when then can find 3rd world employees to work for much less and do comparable work? Also, should US companies be obligated to provide health care for those 3rd world employees?
It is kind or hard to outsource service industry jobs offshore.
Posted Image

"Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed


Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder.
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brumdog44 Jul 22 2013, 04:49 PM Post #189
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Jul 22 2013, 04:46 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 04:26 PM
brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:08 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
Brum, I apologize if I missed your answer, as I haven't been following this forum closely, but do you think US companies have an obligation to pay US workers $9/hr when then can find 3rd world employees to work for much less and do comparable work? Also, should US companies be obligated to provide health care for those 3rd world employees?
It is kind or hard to outsource service industry jobs offshore.
It certainly would change the meaning of 'fast food'.
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brumdog44 Jul 22 2013, 05:05 PM Post #190
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Mr Gray
Jul 22 2013, 04:14 PM
brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
aaron, I'm talking about the fact that most workers at McDonald's aren't able to get 40 hours there. That hasn't nothing to do with hourly wage, but it does have everything to do with the idea that these workers are just 'lazy' and 'should be able to get by on minimum wage'.
I don't know if they are lazy or not, but if we aren't talking about full time employment, then this conversation is just silly....I'll go on the record and say no...people most likely can't survive on their own working part time at McDonalds....and if anyone on here believes they should, please let me know why.
I'm not suggesting that someone should be able to live on part time minimum wage. I am simply saying that there aren't many minimum wage jobs -- especially fast food jobs -- that have full time opportunity. Remember the tax credit act I talked about previously that gave tax credits for hiring certain employee groups in low income jobs? The Work Opportunity Tax Credit gives a 40% tax credit to certain groups for the first $6000 they earn in their first year of employment with a business. Those 'special groups' that the company receives a tax credit for those that were previously on welfare, food stamps, are social security recipients, poor or disabled veterans, youths from disadvantaged areas, and ex-felons. The group was expanded under the most recent stimulus bill to include unemployed veterans and further expanded it for the young.

From a companies standpoint, the best use of their money would be to hire two employees part time that fit this bill at $6,000 each as opposed to a more qualified person at $12,000, because they will receive a tax credit of $4800 for the two employees. Secondly, two part time employees won't qualify for insurance since they aren't full time.

And there isn't a limit on the credits....which is why it's no big deal if an employee in the qualified group quits or gets fired from these jobs as they can simply be filled by another one in the qualified group. In fact, it is the company's advantage NOT to have the employee stay their first $6000 in earnings as they no longer receive a tax credit for them.
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HoosierLars Jul 22 2013, 05:28 PM Post #191
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eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:46 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 04:26 PM
brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:08 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 03:46 PM
eelbor
Jul 22 2013, 10:05 AM
HoosierLars
Jul 22 2013, 10:02 AM
sirbrianwilson
Jul 22 2013, 09:54 AM
If I ever eat at McDonald's, it's the sausage mcmuffin with egg during breakfast time.

br
Eel and Aaron FTW. Good time to change the subject...
It would be a very miserable experience. While it could possibly be done, I would not want to do it.
Don't worry, Eel, I think you can make an occasional factual post and still be on Brum's and Brian's "friend list. " :P
Being poor sucks. I think it is the greatest motivator to better oneself there is.
Being poor does suck.

But then again, it seems to me that the solution to not have a minimum wage and see lower wages making them even poorer sucks worse.
Brum, I apologize if I missed your answer, as I haven't been following this forum closely, but do you think US companies have an obligation to pay US workers $9/hr when then can find 3rd world employees to work for much less and do comparable work? Also, should US companies be obligated to provide health care for those 3rd world employees?
It is kind or hard to outsource service industry jobs offshore.

What about service and non-service industry jobs that can be globalized?
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Mr Gray Jul 22 2013, 06:09 PM Post #192
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Jul 22 2013, 05:05 PM
Mr Gray
Jul 22 2013, 04:14 PM
brumdog44
Jul 22 2013, 04:03 PM
aaron, I'm talking about the fact that most workers at McDonald's aren't able to get 40 hours there. That hasn't nothing to do with hourly wage, but it does have everything to do with the idea that these workers are just 'lazy' and 'should be able to get by on minimum wage'.
I don't know if they are lazy or not, but if we aren't talking about full time employment, then this conversation is just silly....I'll go on the record and say no...people most likely can't survive on their own working part time at McDonalds....and if anyone on here believes they should, please let me know why.
I'm not suggesting that someone should be able to live on part time minimum wage. I am simply saying that there aren't many minimum wage jobs -- especially fast food jobs -- that have full time opportunity. Remember the tax credit act I talked about previously that gave tax credits for hiring certain employee groups in low income jobs? The Work Opportunity Tax Credit gives a 40% tax credit to certain groups for the first $6000 they earn in their first year of employment with a business. Those 'special groups' that the company receives a tax credit for those that were previously on welfare, food stamps, are social security recipients, poor or disabled veterans, youths from disadvantaged areas, and ex-felons. The group was expanded under the most recent stimulus bill to include unemployed veterans and further expanded it for the young.

From a companies standpoint, the best use of their money would be to hire two employees part time that fit this bill at $6,000 each as opposed to a more qualified person at $12,000, because they will receive a tax credit of $4800 for the two employees. Secondly, two part time employees won't qualify for insurance since they aren't full time.

And there isn't a limit on the credits....which is why it's no big deal if an employee in the qualified group quits or gets fired from these jobs as they can simply be filled by another one in the qualified group. In fact, it is the company's advantage NOT to have the employee stay their first $6000 in earnings as they no longer receive a tax credit for them.
So then why are we debating whether or not someone can live off of full time minimum wage employment if it is such a rare situation?
Posted Image
The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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eelbor Jul 22 2013, 07:15 PM Post #193
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Because McDonalds was stupid enough to post a budget for people to nitpick
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"Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed


Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder.
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Jazen Jul 22 2013, 07:33 PM Post #194
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Jul 22 2013, 04:15 PM
or they could figure out how to rely on themselves instead of the government or their employer via government regulation and no longer be poor.
Not everyone, in fact there are lots of people in this country, that simply don't have the intellect to sustain a good education and subsequently a decent career that allows them to do much better than minimum wage. Needless to say, these people simply don't know how to rely on themselves, or if so, at a very minimum.

IMO, minimum wage is essentially targeted for these types of people, along with high school students and/or people that have the intellect but just don't care (could throw lazy in there as well).

In this case, and even though poor, I'd guess most are grateful that they even have a job.




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Mr Gray Jul 22 2013, 08:28 PM Post #195
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Jul 22 2013, 07:33 PM
Mr Gray
Jul 22 2013, 04:15 PM
or they could figure out how to rely on themselves instead of the government or their employer via government regulation and no longer be poor.
Not everyone, in fact there are lots of people in this country, that simply don't have the intellect to sustain a good education and subsequently a decent career that allows them to do much better than minimum wage. Needless to say, these people simply don't know how to rely on themselves, or if so, at a very minimum.

IMO, minimum wage is essentially targeted for these types of people, along with high school students and/or people that have the intellect but just don't care (could throw lazy in there as well).

In this case, and even though poor, I'd guess most are grateful that they even have a job.




Getting above minimum wage doesn't require a great deal of intellect. It does require a little drive. If someone isn't driven to better themselves, I'm not sure why taxpayers or employers should be forced to do it for them.
Posted Image
The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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