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Minimum Wage; ..for your consumption
Tweet Topic Started: Jul 16 2013, 01:14 PM (1,720 Views)
brumdog44 Jul 20 2013, 04:38 PM Post #121
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dreachon
Jul 20 2013, 03:07 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 03:01 PM
"Studies show approximately 80 percent of Wal-Mart employees are forced to use food stamps and cost taxpayers an average of $1.02 billion in healthcare costs annually."


http://www.salon.com/2013/07/18/dont_fall_for_wal_marts_latest_hypocrisy/
Basically what's happening is that company's can pass their costs onto consumers by not paying their employees a livable wage.
Where are the people asking about 'why is the corporation asked to foot the bill'? I want to know why general public is asked to pay the living wage difference so the corporation can get off cheap.
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brumdog44 Jul 20 2013, 04:48 PM Post #122
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Jul 20 2013, 12:47 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 11:16 AM
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Jul 20 2013, 11:07 AM
My question to the group, did anyone on here believe you could survive on a 40 hour a week job at McDonald's? I never did. I grew past those jobs many years ago while I still had a parental safety net.
I think it depends. Single, no kids, not in a big expensive city? You could probably get by with a 1 bedroom efficiency or something. But you'll just be treading water. Forget being able to save any money.
I left the house at 18 ( a couple of months after I graduated high school), and got a job working at an insurance company in the small town of Lawrenceville, IL. At that time in 1985 minimum wage was $3.35 an hour. Work was only 4 or 5 blocks from my apartment -- luckily because I didn't have a car -- but in the grand scheme of things I couldn't have afforded the gas anyway.

I was able to pay $180.00 in rent every month, light bill and water bill, barely had enough for food but I survived with almost nothing left over.

My point is, I wouldn't have a clue as to how a single person in a small efficiency apartment could survive in today's economy versus the cost of living on minimum wage. Maybe it can be done today, I really wouldn't know.
Using constant dollars (the source I cited previously uses 1996 dollars), when the minimum wage first hit $3.35, it was worth $5.78 in 1996 dollars. In 2009, when the minimum wage hit $7.25, it was worth $5.30. Mathematically, a $7.25 minimum wage when it was first enacted is equivalent to having a minimum wage of $3.05 from when you are talking about when you had minimum wage.
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Jazen Jul 20 2013, 04:52 PM Post #123
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Jul 20 2013, 04:48 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 12:47 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 11:16 AM
eelbor
Jul 20 2013, 11:07 AM
My question to the group, did anyone on here believe you could survive on a 40 hour a week job at McDonald's? I never did. I grew past those jobs many years ago while I still had a parental safety net.
I think it depends. Single, no kids, not in a big expensive city? You could probably get by with a 1 bedroom efficiency or something. But you'll just be treading water. Forget being able to save any money.
I left the house at 18 ( a couple of months after I graduated high school), and got a job working at an insurance company in the small town of Lawrenceville, IL. At that time in 1985 minimum wage was $3.35 an hour. Work was only 4 or 5 blocks from my apartment -- luckily because I didn't have a car -- but in the grand scheme of things I couldn't have afforded the gas anyway.

I was able to pay $180.00 in rent every month, light bill and water bill, barely had enough for food but I survived with almost nothing left over.

My point is, I wouldn't have a clue as to how a single person in a small efficiency apartment could survive in today's economy versus the cost of living on minimum wage. Maybe it can be done today, I really wouldn't know.
Using constant dollars (the source I cited previously uses 1996 dollars), when the minimum wage first hit $3.35, it was worth $5.78 in 1996 dollars. In 2009, when the minimum wage hit $7.25, it was worth $5.30. Mathematically, a $7.25 minimum wage when it was first enacted is equivalent to having a minimum wage of $3.05 from when you are talking about when you had minimum wage.
So although hungry, I was living high on the hog. But seriously, a roommate back then never even crossed my mind. Not sure how anyone can live on it without a second income these days. No matter what the situation.
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eelbor Jul 20 2013, 06:46 PM Post #124
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Jul 20 2013, 04:38 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 03:07 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 03:01 PM
"Studies show approximately 80 percent of Wal-Mart employees are forced to use food stamps and cost taxpayers an average of $1.02 billion in healthcare costs annually."


http://www.salon.com/2013/07/18/dont_fall_for_wal_marts_latest_hypocrisy/
Basically what's happening is that company's can pass their costs onto consumers by not paying their employees a livable wage.
Where are the people asking about 'why is the corporation asked to foot the bill'? I want to know why general public is asked to pay the living wage difference so the corporation can get off cheap.
I do not shop at Walmart for this very reason.
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"Liberal, shmiberal. That should be a new word. Shmiberal: one who is assumed liberal, just because he's a professional whiner in the newspaper. If you'll read the subtext for many of those old strips, you'll find the heart of an old-fashioned Libertarian. And I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners." - Berkeley Breathed


Meat is Murder. Sweet, delicious murder.
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Mr Gray Jul 20 2013, 07:44 PM Post #125
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brumdog44
Jul 20 2013, 04:38 PM
dreachon
Jul 20 2013, 03:07 PM
dreachon
Jul 20 2013, 03:01 PM
"Studies show approximately 80 percent of Wal-Mart employees are forced to use food stamps and cost taxpayers an average of $1.02 billion in healthcare costs annually."


http://www.salon.com/2013/07/18/dont_fall_for_wal_marts_latest_hypocrisy/
Basically what's happening is that company's can pass their costs onto consumers by not paying their employees a livable wage.
Where are the people asking about 'why is the corporation asked to foot the bill'? I want to know why general public is asked to pay the living wage difference so the corporation can get off cheap.
When did it become the corporations responsibility to provide for The general welfare of society?
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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Mr Gray Jul 20 2013, 07:48 PM Post #126
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Jul 20 2013, 10:54 AM
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Jul 20 2013, 07:49 AM
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Jul 20 2013, 12:07 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 19 2013, 09:34 PM
I will address the chart when I have time, however I need to point out that I actually don't care about the chart.
Therein lies your problem. You accuse others of having their mind closed to the subject and then flat out say you don't even care about the point that presented to begin with.

BTW, nothing is keeping churches and local community groups from helping people in poverty now, are they? Yet, strangely.....they exist in tens of millions.
My problem? It's not being close minded brum. It's simply that fighting over whether or not minimum wage is survivable is irrelevant to my overall theory that wages should be based upon their worth only. It would be like me asking you to explain whether God is black, white, male, or female, when you don't even think he exists.
So you believe that minimum wage is survivable but don't care about addressing the very first post in thread that addresses the survivability of being on minimum wage?
Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone. I believe it should be up to the individual, and I feel strongly that that mentality originally made this nation the economic superpower that it became.
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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dreachon Jul 20 2013, 08:11 PM Post #127
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Jul 20 2013, 07:48 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 10:54 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 20 2013, 07:49 AM
brumdog44
Jul 20 2013, 12:07 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 19 2013, 09:34 PM
I will address the chart when I have time, however I need to point out that I actually don't care about the chart.
Therein lies your problem. You accuse others of having their mind closed to the subject and then flat out say you don't even care about the point that presented to begin with.

BTW, nothing is keeping churches and local community groups from helping people in poverty now, are they? Yet, strangely.....they exist in tens of millions.
My problem? It's not being close minded brum. It's simply that fighting over whether or not minimum wage is survivable is irrelevant to my overall theory that wages should be based upon their worth only. It would be like me asking you to explain whether God is black, white, male, or female, when you don't even think he exists.
So you believe that minimum wage is survivable but don't care about addressing the very first post in thread that addresses the survivability of being on minimum wage?
Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone. I believe it should be up to the individual, and I feel strongly that that mentality originally made this nation the economic superpower that it became.
So you know it's survivable despite the first post on the board. So go ahead and explain why the first post is wrong.
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Mr Gray Jul 20 2013, 08:40 PM Post #128
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Jul 20 2013, 08:11 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 07:48 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 10:54 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 20 2013, 07:49 AM
brumdog44
Jul 20 2013, 12:07 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 19 2013, 09:34 PM
I will address the chart when I have time, however I need to point out that I actually don't care about the chart.
Therein lies your problem. You accuse others of having their mind closed to the subject and then flat out say you don't even care about the point that presented to begin with.

BTW, nothing is keeping churches and local community groups from helping people in poverty now, are they? Yet, strangely.....they exist in tens of millions.
My problem? It's not being close minded brum. It's simply that fighting over whether or not minimum wage is survivable is irrelevant to my overall theory that wages should be based upon their worth only. It would be like me asking you to explain whether God is black, white, male, or female, when you don't even think he exists.
So you believe that minimum wage is survivable but don't care about addressing the very first post in thread that addresses the survivability of being on minimum wage?
Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone. I believe it should be up to the individual, and I feel strongly that that mentality originally made this nation the economic superpower that it became.
So you know it's survivable despite the first post on the board. So go ahead and explain why the first post is wrong.
I have stated more than once that I will when I have time and can post from a computer instead of my phone from the road. Probably wont be till Monday. For now I'm dealing with the fact that some little shithead kid threw a rock at the lake today and it drilled me on the side of my head at the temple. Actually broke my sunglasses right in half which I think might have saved me from a potentially more serious injury. His dad is my 1st cousin who didnt even make the kid apologize, let alone offer to buy me some new shades. Now I'm just nursing a decent knot, a headache, and a good case of rage. Not in a mood to run numbers.
Edited by Mr Gray, Jul 20 2013, 08:41 PM.
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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yawnzzz Jul 20 2013, 09:37 PM Post #129
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Jul 19 2013, 06:13 PM
Imagine all of the useful projects that could be accomplished if those on welfare were out bettering society. Maybe we should require that people work for their welfare check?
That sounds kind of like the Soviet Union...

I thought you were of the opinion that companies with money in the game are more likely to use resources more productively.
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brumdog44 Jul 20 2013, 10:17 PM Post #130
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Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone.
There is a difference between 'lifestyle' and just having basic necessities.
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HoosierLars Jul 20 2013, 10:18 PM Post #131
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yawnzzz
Jul 20 2013, 09:37 PM
HoosierLars
Jul 19 2013, 06:13 PM
Imagine all of the useful projects that could be accomplished if those on welfare were out bettering society. Maybe we should require that people work for their welfare check?
That sounds kind of like the Soviet Union...

I thought you were of the opinion that companies with money in the game are more likely to use resources more productively.
Perhaps, but given that we have collectively decided to provide some level of safety net with welfare, wouldn't it be better if society got something back, and the person on the dole contributed something to the collective? Or do you think handing out free money is better?
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Mr Gray Jul 21 2013, 07:35 AM Post #132
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Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone.
There is a difference between 'lifestyle' and just having basic necessities.
No, that actually is a form of lifestyle.
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The body knows what fighters don't: how to protect itself. A neck can only twist so far. Twist it just a hair more and the body says, "Hey, I'll take it from here because you obviously don't know what you're doing... Lie down now, rest, and we'll talk about this when you regain your senses." It's called the knockout mechanism.
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sirbrianwilson Jul 21 2013, 03:00 PM Post #133
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Jul 20 2013, 08:40 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 07:48 PM
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Jul 20 2013, 10:54 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 20 2013, 07:49 AM
brumdog44
Jul 20 2013, 12:07 AM
Mr Gray
Jul 19 2013, 09:34 PM
I will address the chart when I have time, however I need to point out that I actually don't care about the chart.
Therein lies your problem. You accuse others of having their mind closed to the subject and then flat out say you don't even care about the point that presented to begin with.

BTW, nothing is keeping churches and local community groups from helping people in poverty now, are they? Yet, strangely.....they exist in tens of millions.
My problem? It's not being close minded brum. It's simply that fighting over whether or not minimum wage is survivable is irrelevant to my overall theory that wages should be based upon their worth only. It would be like me asking you to explain whether God is black, white, male, or female, when you don't even think he exists.
So you believe that minimum wage is survivable but don't care about addressing the very first post in thread that addresses the survivability of being on minimum wage?
Yes, I know it's survivable, however even if it wasnt it doesn't change my view on it. It isn't corporate America's responsibility to ensure any type of lifestyle for anyone. I believe it should be up to the individual, and I feel strongly that that mentality originally made this nation the economic superpower that it became.
So you know it's survivable despite the first post on the board. So go ahead and explain why the first post is wrong.
I have stated more than once that I will when I have time and can post from a computer instead of my phone from the road. Probably wont be till Monday. For now I'm dealing with the fact that some little shithead kid threw a rock at the lake today and it drilled me on the side of my head at the temple. Actually broke my sunglasses right in half which I think might have saved me from a potentially more serious injury. His dad is my 1st cousin who didnt even make the kid apologize, let alone offer to buy me some new shades. Now I'm just nursing a decent knot, a headache, and a good case of rage. Not in a mood to run numbers.
It's going to take a lot longer than Monday to figure out how to live on minimum wage at 40 hrs a week.

And that's not even counting if you have a kid (which is yet to be addressed)...

br
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HoosierLars Jul 21 2013, 10:25 PM Post #134
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Some of you have been asking Aaron detailed questions about living on minimum wage.

Here are a couple for you:
1) What should minimum wage be? (e.g. $15 or $20)
2) Who should set that rate? (e.g. the Federal government)
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brumdog44 Jul 21 2013, 10:33 PM Post #135
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Jul 21 2013, 10:25 PM
Some of you have been asking Aaron detailed questions about living on minimum wage.

Here are a couple for you:
1) What should minimum wage be? (e.g. $15 or $20)
2) Who should set that rate? (e.g. the Federal government)
So I assume you are now admitting that you can't live on minimum wage.
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