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Civilization Weekend!; Not actually a weekend, but I like "Weekend" at the end of it.
Topic Started: Aug 12 2014, 08:52 PM (2,982 Views)
Romanticide
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I'd say yes lol. If you didn't compromise infrastructure to get all those Wonders, you're not hurting yourself by getting them. It's pretty rare to have a game SO great that you can build all you need, plus get a lot of Wonders.


Anyway, continuing the Morocco game.

I've never really given thought to what I consider "the mid game", but if I were pressed, I would say the mid-game starts at the National College and lasts until the Modern Era. Once you hit the Modern Era, you get an ideology. It seems like a decent cut-off point for the mid-game.

With that in mind, this part of the guide will last from T113 (where we finished the NC) until whenever we reach the Modern Era.

Things we need to do for success here:
-Reach Education, build Universities ASAP.
-Head for Astronomy, build a Caravel and get exploring.
-OPEN RATIONALISM.
-Get our spy to level 3, leave it in the capital until the Industrial Era to protect our lead.
-Research Chivalry and build Kasbahs everywhere we can. Won't build them on Flood Plains tiles though; Farms are too good on those.
-Build Workshops everywhere so we can put Ironworks in our least productive city and get it up to snuff.
-Build the Writer's/Artist's Guilds in Marrakech.
-Get Printing Press, build the Leaning Tower of Pisa if possible. If all goes well, we should lead the World Congress on Emperor. (and Immortal. Deity? Not in this particular game.)
-Get Acoustics and build the Sistine Chapel if possible.
-Research Banking and build the Forbidden Palace.
-Build Oxford and use it to pop Scientific Method the turn after we research Economics. (There are alternative uses for Oxford, more later.)
-Research Industrialization, pray to RNGesus for at least 3 Coal for Factories.
-Build the vital infrastructure of this era in every city: Public Schools and Factories. Hospitals are in this era but off the beeline to Plastics.
-If we get an Ideology, start taking tenets in it. Thinking Freedom atm: I can use Faith to get a lot of Great Scientists and I can use Morocco's economic edge to outright buy many of the spaceship parts.
-Enter the Modern Era via Radio or Replaceable Parts.
-In general, build more trade routes and keep growing, growing, growing.

Bonus goals:
-Build Notre Dame. The +10 Happiness is HUGE, but the AI loves this Wonder.
-Most any other unmentioned Wonder that isn't ass (read: not Angkor Wat) is a bonus, really.

I feel like I should have written down build orders for each city too. That would have been helpful, even if I only posted them in the last post along with some explanations as to what I did. As it is, the best I can do is probably write about buildings you should build in each city, situational buildings, and buildings to avoid.

Anyway...


Guide, Part 2
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Romanticide
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Finished it. With that in mind, I'll post the last couple of things I have to post.


As you might guess, the endgame lasts from the start of the Modern Era until... Well, it ends. That's self-explanatory.

There isn't much left to do here, really, but let's make a list anyway.

-Coup as many city-states as possible.
-Build the Statue of Liberty.
-Reach Plastics, build Research Labs.
-Head for Biology, build Hospitals.
-Research Railroads, connect cities to the capital.
-Research Rocketry, build the Apollo Project
-Research the techs we need to build spaceship parts: Satellites, Advanced Ballistics, Particle Physics, Nanotechnology.
-Build needed infrastructure/maybe a defensive military, I guess.

Well, this list is pretty simple. A lot of the difficulty IMO is in learning to survive the early game/building your shit up in the mid-game. The endgame, by comparison, is a lot easier. Let's get on with it though.


Guide, the Finale


But that's not all!

Like I was saying, the thing I was missing in my game was the answer to "Ro, when do you build certain buildings? How do you decide?" Well, I feel there are certain buildings that are better/more necessary than others, which is what this list attempts to sort through. I've divided it into various categories, with those near the top being the most necessary and those at the bottom being less/not at all necessary. This is far from a binding list obviously; it's just how I think.

I'll mention some Unique Buildings but won't consider them separately. Most are better than their regular counterpart anyway.



Buildings
Edited by Romanticide, Dec 3 2014, 10:39 AM.
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Romanticide
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http://www.civilization.com/en/news/2014-12--civilization-beyond-earth-fall-update-now-live/

There are a LOT of changes here, many of which were sorely needed, so expect a long post.

lots of stuff



All in all, this is a nice first patch, but I'll have to play BE to see how the game has changed. Even if it's changed for the better, which it probably has, there's still a lot of work to do. Hoping for expansions; those would help a lot to improve this game.
Edited by Romanticide, Dec 9 2014, 03:55 AM.
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tfghost92
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at turn 230 of this new game I am playing, I have had a feud with Montezuma on my continent for almost the entire game. Working on my religion spreading, and that stupid piece of shit tried to send a great prophet into my holy city. I violated my research agreements and defensive pacts with Washington and Maria I just to spite him. I am fucking pissed in an unnecessary way. All I want to do is wipe him off the planet now. Honestly I am super ahead in tech (lmfao I only have one city) and could do it easily (I already liberated two of Maria's cities from him with a few pikemen and a catapult a hundred turns ago) the issue is I don't have the army built up yet but it should be pretty easy
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tfghost92
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I WILL BURN THIS MOTHERFUCKER'S CITIES DOWN AND SHIT ON THE ASHES
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Romanticide
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Defensive pacts are useless IMO. They have the potential to pull you into awkward wars, like with someone you've had a DoF with for the whole game, which will give you the negative modifier for backstabbing your friend and has the potential to torpedo your diplomacy for the rest of the game. I also usually don't build a lot of troops, so I'd never be ready for one of those wars.

Even if a neighbor is sending their troops towards your borders or something, it's better to bribe them to declare war elsewhere or bribe someone else to declare war on whoever is threatening you.

And yeah, I hate those sorts of peace treaties, never mind that you've likely eliminated most/all of their military. The AI will give more reasonable deals if it feels a city is threatened, and will definitely give better deals if you've taken one or two cities. But you're not interested in that, so burn his shit down.
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tfghost92
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I lead the World Congress and already successfully passed an embargo on the Aztecs. just about every country in the world has denounced him and half of them have been in at least one war with them. They're kind of a joke and its blowing my mind that the AI is playing this way. yeah sure its AU bu nigga please. This is horrible. every country wants him dead. The only thing he is doing is absolutely dominating in religion. Nearly every city in the game is influenced by Catholicism. I've tried to keep it out of my city but Trade Routes are necessary for my success and my trade routes spread his religion. Its already come up in the world congress to vote Catholicism the world religion. So he's doing well. But he also is trying to play Warmonger with the United States, who is next to me and a close ally, and Maria who I am basically protecting at this point. Montezuma actually chooses not to war with Portugal because they know I am there to protect her. Which reminds me, I need to raise an army and liberate her capital. he swept in around turn 100 and took out all of her cities except one before I had a chance to beat him back, but I ran out of troops before I finished with the capital.


EDIT

Oh yeah, he built an army, took Philadelphia out and I was trying to liberate it. I came so close and then he razed Philly. I was furious so I just went ham on like 2 of his cities before I ran out of troops and hadto call a peace treaty. Once the Aztecs are dealt with, I can focus on winning this game. I decided to go culture because I had an assload of culture slots and stuff. Not sure if I mentioned it but I am the Inca and so far I am absolutely loving it
Edited by tfghost92, Dec 24 2014, 06:53 PM.
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Romanticide
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Inca are seriously OP. They can grow huge cities in terrain nobody else even really wants because they get an awesome Unique Improvement. I suppose they're a better Morocco in that way. The Terrace Farm is better than the Kasbah and it comes earlier. I normally don't advocate early Construction unless you have major Happiness issues (not on the Education beeline), but with the Inca you need it to maximize their potential. Unique Ability is legit. Not the best but it works with what you do as the Inca and it gives you a slight edge in early game scouting. Slinger is meh but who cares.

Sounds to me like you're doing alright, at least from what I hear. Leading the World Congress is a good indicator that you are indeed ahead in tech, or at least near the lead. Getting an embargo to pass is generally not easy unless the civ in question is hated or unless you've sent diplomats to make deals. Recognizing that you can get an embargo passed and screw another player is a sign of improvement. If you're going Culture, you should propose Arts Funding if you haven't. It'll pass easy and you'll get a positive diplo modifier for it.

And yeah, a lot of AI put Faith generation ahead of all else. I kinda wish they'd stop caring about it as the game goes on and instead stockpile it for more useful things, like Great People. Then again, if they actually played the game somewhat efficiently on higher difficulties, they'd almost always win. But that's how it *should* be on Immortal/Deity if you ask me.
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tfghost92
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swag on this dick, bitches
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Romanticide
Dec 24 2014, 07:30 PM
Inca are seriously OP. They can grow huge cities in terrain nobody else even really wants because they get an awesome Unique Improvement. I suppose they're a better Morocco in that way. The Terrace Farm is better than the Kasbah and it comes earlier. I normally don't advocate early Construction unless you have major Happiness issues (not on the Education beeline), but with the Inca you need it to maximize their potential. Unique Ability is legit. Not the best but it works with what you do as the Inca and it gives you a slight edge in early game scouting. Slinger is meh but who cares.

Sounds to me like you're doing alright, at least from what I hear. Leading the World Congress is a good indicator that you are indeed ahead in tech, or at least near the lead. Getting an embargo to pass is generally not easy unless the civ in question is hated or unless you've sent diplomats to make deals. Recognizing that you can get an embargo passed and screw another player is a sign of improvement. If you're going Culture, you should propose Arts Funding if you haven't. It'll pass easy and you'll get a positive diplo modifier for it.

And yeah, a lot of AI put Faith generation ahead of all else. I kinda wish they'd stop caring about it as the game goes on and instead stockpile it for more useful things, like Great People. Then again, if they actually played the game somewhat efficiently on higher difficulties, they'd almost always win. But that's how it *should* be on Immortal/Deity if you ask me.
i actually just lost the world congress recently. America swept the voting. they're doing really well with diplomacy. the Aztecs are fighting me but not on the ground. The way I see it, if I don't start running a train on this culture victory soon, they'll dominate this game. Everyone hates the Aztecs so they'll never win world leader but fuck me if they aren't dominating in nearly every category.
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tfghost92
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I call this little area the Nutsack Peninsula and its hilarious because I one point I had a small war right there and I call it the nutsack war of 1700
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Romanticide
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Couple of things, one Civ-related, the other one only semi-related.

Civ-related:

http://kotaku.com/australia-makes-civ-v-history-1681794279

Pretty cool mod. I'll have to give it the ol' college try in an actual game, but I like the idea of a mod civ that's actually voiced and all that jazz, even if the leader model is an amalgamation of already existing assets.

As far as the civ goes, it probably won't be one of my favorites based on an UA that creates puppet cities (gold focus sucks, as does the science penalty), but I do like the idea of upgradeable workers and a use for Tourism beyond gunning for a Culture win.


Semi-related:

[utube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPwo53ezxGA&feature=youtu.be[/utube]

Looks like a Galactic Civilizations (though not made by a company run by an asshole) and Fire Emblem hybrid to me, based on what was shown here. I like what I saw here, even if the ~25 minutes of gameplay really didn't show that much.
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Romanticide
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http://kotaku.com/civilization-players-are-sending-the-entire-world-to-wa-1686637399

Hell. Yes. I used to enjoy watching /v/ streams of Mario Party where they set 4 CPU to easy. Shenanigans happen. People talk shit about rival fans. I expect much the same here. The trashtalk thread on r/civ is hilarious. But yeah, I expect the real updates on this to come out of r/civ.

#TeamSioux

I also downloaded a fair number of these civs. Didn't download many warlike civs (war = boring, etc), though the Buccaneers sound different, with a focus on naval warfare. Guess I'll be playing some Civ sometime, idk when. Still want to work on Liberty/war/both strats anyway.
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Romanticide
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You know how I've said Piety was bad in the past? I might have been very wrong on that count. Piety *seems* bad because it doesn't directly contribute to your civ, especially at the start where you want growth and culture above all. However, if you stay small so most AIs don't covet your land and utilize the game's mechanisms to catch up (Research Agreements, Spies, lower tech costs once others have researched techs, etc) in the mid/late-game, Piety might be more viable than the Civ community gives it credit for. You also need to be good at diplomacy.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=521674

I'll just point out that all of OP's guide is ~18k words, so I don't expect anyone to read it other than me. It's also aimed at Deity play and goes in-depth, so... Yeah. However, I feel this would work on the lower levels; nothing this guide does is inherent to Deity (read: you aren't exploiting the Deity AI). POINT BEING: Feel free to fuck around and try weird shit. If there's anything to get out of this post, it's this.

A lot of the love for Tradition/4 cities/Science stems from the simple fact that it's safe. I still stand by that being the most consistent and easiest path to victory, but at some point it gets boring. That's why I want to improve my all-around game. There's so much to do beyond "lol build 4 cities and turtle until the spaceship".


http://www.reddit.com/r/civ/comments/2wj8tt/battle_royale_frequently_asked_questions/

Also, it seems the 43 AI civs game has a more formal structure now. tl;dr: Streams at 12 PM on Saturdays, Sydney time (I believe that's 5 PM PST/7 PM CST/8 PM EST on Friday for us), new imgur albums at 11 AM Sydney time every day.


EDIT: http://www.civilization.com/en/news/2015-02-information-on-the-civilization-beyond-earth-winter-2015-update/

IMPROVED WONDERS BABY

This was one of my bigger gripes with Beyond Earth. There were only a few worth building, but now it seems many will be worth building, depending on situation/victory type/etc.

The way I see it, Promethean/Resurrection Device/the Eudamonia policy is going to be OP as shit. Idk how early you could get this set up (probably a tad before late-game if you beeline the right side of the web), but once you do you can probably go as wide as you like with no repercussions.

Trade routes getting re-balanced is amazing. I like the idea of unlocking trade routes at certain population thresholds. It's way too easy to found a city and then have like three domestic routes bringing in so much Food/Production that buildings can be built in ~5 turns even at pop 1. This change by itself will probably slow games down a fair bit. Part of me likes the fast pace of BE, but I know that fast pace is largely because trade routes were OP. Auto-renewing trade routes is pretty cool tho, if only because I'm lazy and there are 2039403945 of them.

Might give BE a spin or two at some point. These patches were much-needed.
Edited by Romanticide, Feb 21 2015, 12:27 AM.
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Volt
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Keep Moving Forward

I just spent the last few days playing Civ 5 for the first time and getting to know it.

The game is pretty good. I really like just how many different mechanics there are in the game, and I especially like how everything is historical. I like the feel of being in control of my own empire, and interacting with other nations.

Yet, I'm not having very much fun. Each time I played the game, I put in at least 3 hours into it, but at the end of every session I'm left wondering what exactly I even accomplished. I never feel like I do anything in this game; nothing really seems worthwhile. Everything in the game takes so much time. A lot of the turns consist of me doing nothing, and then hoping the next turn lets me do something interesting. And anything I do end up doing, I want to follow it up with something that will require even more wasted turns waiting.

I'm just not sure if this series is for me. Growing up on RTS games, I'm used to much faster paced gameplay, and high levels of interactivity. I really wanted to love this game as much as everyone else seems to, but I'm just not feeling it.
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Romanticide
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Try a domination victory. As the name implies, you'll be building troops and conducting wars, as opposed to building shit and clicking next turn. Science/Culture victories are cool and all, but they can be very passive victories. Diplo victories are boring IMO and I don't do them, in large part because they're also very passive. The fastest Science victories actually do involve a bit of warfare (getting 5-6 cities early is pretty hard), but yeah, I've never tried that.

Another idea might be to turn the difficulty up. At Prince/below, you'll probably never be threatened, even if you turtle for 300+ turns and don't build any military whatsoever. On King/Emperor, the AI starts to build more military and declare war if it feels you're weak, so you won't be able to get away with no military strats anymore until you improve. That might be a pretty big jump though since idk what you're playing at.

I'm not very good at domination myself because I don't do it a lot (most of my unplayed civs are militaristic civs), but I would recommend three cities, then building an army and starting to conquer shit. Your army should be mostly ranged for the simple reason that it allows you to attack from more tiles. I usually have 10+ ranged units in my armies by the end, though 4-6 are more than sufficient early. Build 2-4 siege units (Catapult/Trebuchet/etc) to make taking cities easier. You'll need a few melee units (4-6+) to take cities/absorb attacks/protect ranged units. A navy isn't strictly necessary unless on watery maps, in which case you'll want 5-6 ranged naval units and I guess a few melee ships to take cities. You only keep capitals/good cities, everything else gets razed. Good cities to me are cities that offer strategic benefits/resources, unique luxuries, and/or World Wonders.

Policy-wise I prefer Liberty; you'll have 10+ cities by the end of the game. You can go Honor too, but for the most part you don't need its bonuses. AI is dumb, etc. Commerce is essential for the money/happiness. Rationalism is always good. Ideology can be Order/Autocracy.

But yeah. If you haven't tried domination, I'd recommend it. If you have and didn't enjoy it, idk what I can tell you. The game might not be for you, which happens.
Edited by Romanticide, Mar 21 2015, 06:55 AM.
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