| Episode 15; The Finale | |
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| Topic Started: Apr 22 2018, 10:15:37 AM (2,026 Views) | |
| Master Hand | Apr 22 2018, 10:15:37 AM Post #1 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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Pikachu was... There's still time for FTC to change things but Ness has an incredibly uphill climb here. |
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| Isaac | Apr 22 2018, 10:37:39 AM Post #2 |
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I feel like the theme of this game was exciting rounds with predictable results. Fitting the FTC will finish that theme. |
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| Xananab | Apr 22 2018, 10:38:51 AM Post #3 |
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Robbed Goddess I'm sorry I started rooting for you it doomed you like all my other favs |
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| Isaac | Apr 22 2018, 10:43:29 AM Post #4 |
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So while the FTC begins im gonna ask you all a question i ask often at the end of games: Who is on your Super Survivor Bros. DVD boxcase? Id probably put Ike, Kirby, Pikachu on the top and then Ness, Jigglypuff and Falcon on the bottom. |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 22 2018, 11:29:43 AM Post #5 |
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No dk????? |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 22 2018, 11:32:10 AM Post #6 |
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Dk in Ike out. I think Mario and Yoshi and dedede would also go on the cover before ike |
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| Lyn | Apr 22 2018, 11:36:36 AM Post #7 |
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I refuse to put the winner on the DVD boxcase. They always do. In terms of interest or compelling players I'd probably put Ike - Interesting player. He felt real and genuine. He played a solid game with flaws that came back to bite him, and his relationships were interesting to follow. His vote out was one of the more interesting ones because the cause of his elimination was more interesting than most. C. Falcon - Another interesting addition to the game. Everyone's different reactions to him were great to see, and how varied they were. He kept the entertainment factor up, and how over the top he was edgically. Really fitting for a C. Falcon character. Mario - Again, he was interesting because he played a unique game I feel, where he was upfront and honest all game, and always the underdog. Whenever you think he's the boot, something else happens and he stays in because he was able to do the right thing at the right time consistently before his boot. Kirby - Dominant winner and very impressive game. He survived being sniped a couple times, especially in the first swap, so he certainly had to work for the win. Pikachu - Shadoweh is always entertaining. A roller coaster of emotions all the way through, but a dominant player in everything. Jiggly + DK: Favorite alliance of the game. Robbed too soon. They played to win, and it backfired only because Kirby was a beast. So removing Kirby because he probably won, I'd put Pikachu, Falcon, Ike, Mario, Jiggly, and DK on the cover. Dedede, Yoshi, Fox, Ness and a lot of the early boots were pretty great too. I don't think there were any duds. Good cast, good season imo. Edited by Lyn, Apr 22 2018, 11:48:38 AM.
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 22 2018, 11:39:06 AM Post #8 |
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Not really loving juror Pika. |
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| Medli | Apr 22 2018, 11:47:08 AM Post #9 |
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Neku for Smash!
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While I understand not wanting to include the winner, in this case I think Kirby was an important enough player throughout the entire game that it would be more notable if he wasn't on it than if he was. |
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| Lyn | Apr 22 2018, 11:52:32 AM Post #10 |
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Bless fox for being the one to play devil's advocate so it's not a complete blowout. Also you're probably right Medlii. Edited by Lyn, Apr 22 2018, 11:53:07 AM.
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 22 2018, 01:05:57 PM Post #11 |
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The legend of Dk's idol bluff lives |
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| Medli | Apr 22 2018, 01:22:43 PM Post #12 |
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Neku for Smash!
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I think maybe Jared might work as an off the box winner, but generally people win by being notable players. I'm blanking right now on other winners that could be safely taken off the cover of the DVD (even though I know there are ones), but while he wasn't quite as dominant as say Season Finale's Jesse or Mass Effect's Harbinger, I still think Kirby was too involved with the important parts of the game to be left out. Anyway, I usually avoid spectating FTC for various reasons, and that's not going to change this time. |
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| Panther Caroso | Apr 22 2018, 01:31:35 PM Post #13 |
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Susan and Karass spring to mind, though at least the latter is largely due to not having a great confessional |
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| Tabuu | Apr 22 2018, 01:40:42 PM Post #14 |
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I might swap ness out for mario? And Id put falcon on top and bump Ike down. |
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| Piplup | Apr 22 2018, 01:50:11 PM Post #15 |
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Kirby, Pikachu, Yoshi, Falcon, DK, one of [Ness/Mario] are probably my six? |
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| Paper Luigi | Apr 22 2018, 03:54:23 PM Post #16 |
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me, Xananab, Lyn, Charizard, The President and Beast Ganon |
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| Palutena | Apr 22 2018, 04:43:36 PM Post #17 |
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rip cant say kirby doesnt deserve this but damn if it's not predictable and boring |
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| The President | Apr 22 2018, 04:45:14 PM Post #18 |
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I absolutely share Pikachu's frustrations with this jury. |
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| The President | Apr 22 2018, 04:48:09 PM Post #19 |
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ahahahahahaha that's a funny legacy for our friend DK |
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| Panther Caroso | Apr 22 2018, 04:52:22 PM Post #20 |
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This isn't going to get fun to watch anytime soon Go home folks this one's over |
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| The President | Apr 22 2018, 04:57:53 PM Post #21 |
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the fact that everyone is ridiculously misguided about the idols is hella fun. otherwise no, juries are not usually fun daytime viewing. just the way juries are. |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 22 2018, 05:01:14 PM Post #22 |
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ffffffffff |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 22 2018, 05:01:21 PM Post #23 |
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I liked ete jurytime |
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| Slippy Toad | Apr 22 2018, 05:03:21 PM Post #24 |
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EtE jury was boring af. School jury is where it's at. |
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| Slippy Toad | Apr 22 2018, 05:03:33 PM Post #25 |
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Actually no LoL jury was the best. |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 22 2018, 05:08:02 PM Post #26 |
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your mom jury boring |
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| The President | Apr 22 2018, 05:10:34 PM Post #27 |
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EtE jury managed to magically convince me to vote for someone I hated over two people I liked quite a lot and played well, it was a spooky experience. Ned's/LoL juries were very dramatic and all, if you're into that. With Fox's hardpush of Ness here, it is worth mentioning that Fox has pushed hard for someone to win who he didn't want to win or vote for before haha. As Tyrael. |
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| Isaac | Apr 22 2018, 06:21:50 PM Post #28 |
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For me I usually put, at most one person from pre-merge. Between Jigglypuff and DK, while DK was certainly an amazing player to view, I think Jigglypuff was a much more dynamic figure in the game. DK's plays wouldn't have gone off without her support, and she was a favorite to win early on, whereas DK never found his footing. It would be a tough call. If I was being honest, I think I could even find myself bumping Ness off the DVD cover for DK instead, but I still feel Ness shaped a lot of this game, for better or worse. |
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| Mr. Resetti | Apr 22 2018, 06:49:09 PM Post #29 |
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Just put all of NuBlue tribe on it |
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 22 2018, 06:59:46 PM Post #30 |
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I see this actually being a close TC, since Ike and Fox are both locks for Ness. I can see Ness swaying one more person with a decent FTC or using the "I was never targeted and everyone wanted me at the end, so therefore I'm obviously the best player" argument. If Kirby loses, I'll say he was robbed unless he has the worst speech of all time, though. |
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| Isaac | Apr 22 2018, 07:18:09 PM Post #31 |
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I certainly hope Ness can put up a really good fight to make it a nice 4-3 victory, but I agree if Ness somehow does pull this victory out, Kirby would have been robbed. Ness played great, but against Kirby I don't see it as a winning game. Maybe Kirby will flub his jury management and piss people off. Ness is as sweet as pie and I don't see him really botching his FTC performance as easily as Kirby might. |
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| Waluigi | Apr 22 2018, 09:09:20 PM Post #32 |
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| Waluigi | Apr 22 2018, 09:10:17 PM Post #33 |
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| Waluigi | Apr 22 2018, 09:11:09 PM Post #34 |
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IN HINDSIGHT GAME STARTING SUCKING WHEN JIGGLY LEFT |
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| Nintendo 64 | Apr 22 2018, 10:26:53 PM Post #35 |
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You take that back
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| Panther Caroso | Apr 22 2018, 11:30:08 PM Post #36 |
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Hey, it's not necessarily bad to be not the center of attention. |
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| Panther Caroso | Apr 22 2018, 11:33:56 PM Post #37 |
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That said I should know better than to make posts like that one because I invariably do it poorly. |
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| Mr. Resetti | Apr 23 2018, 12:11:10 AM Post #38 |
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don't we all. |
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| Mr. Resetti | Apr 23 2018, 12:21:30 AM Post #39 |
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Since I can't actually go and rant at the jury members, who would like me to type up what I may or may not have written here? |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 23 2018, 01:43:43 AM Post #40 |
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ye |
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| Donkey Kong | Apr 23 2018, 05:45:30 AM Post #41 |
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Ook
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![]() I hadn't realised Kirby never told him it was a fake. I really hope this comes up at FTC in some way. |
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| Galaxia Darkness | Apr 23 2018, 08:13:56 AM Post #42 |
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nvm
Edited by Galaxia Darkness, Apr 23 2018, 11:16:16 AM.
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 23 2018, 09:36:27 AM Post #43 |
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same tbh |
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| Paper Luigi | Apr 23 2018, 10:33:39 AM Post #44 |
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I don't like this Outwit/Outplay/Outlast crap tbh |
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| Master Hand | Apr 23 2018, 10:36:55 AM Post #45 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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I do like it, because it forces the Jury to at least think about all three aspects of the game. |
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| Donkey Kong | Apr 23 2018, 10:43:54 AM Post #46 |
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Ook
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I think splitting it up into categories is okay, but these categories aren't great - it was obviously made as a catchy slogan and was never supposed to be 3 separate aspects. Like, outplay in the show's context means challenge performance, but the word itself would mean voting and alliances and such too. Outwit fits pretty well into the voting and alliances portion, but it doesn't really cover general socialising and getting to know people, which it is supposed to. Then you have outlast, which I think is supposed to be about Jury management and how you thought you'd gain their votes, but the word implies nothing like that. |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 11:09:05 AM Post #47 |
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Yeah I never understand what is what with these. Maybe it's interesting to have the players talk in the same threads as each other though. I guess it's just meant to be Social Game Strategic Game Challenges and Idols and shit but trying to cram those into the labels outwit/outplay/outlast always struck me as forced, not that that matters ultimately, as long as everyone does know which is for which Edited by Red Bulborb, Apr 23 2018, 11:10:54 AM.
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| Master Hand | Apr 23 2018, 11:12:10 AM Post #48 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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The three pillars of gameplay are social, strategic, and structural. Outwit and Outplay cover strategic and structural. Outlast for Social is admittedly a stretch. |
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| Galaxia Darkness | Apr 23 2018, 11:15:54 AM Post #49 |
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Yeah, I hate this format. It makes it hard to link ideas. I like ^ interpretation though! |
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| Master Hand | Apr 23 2018, 11:23:29 AM Post #50 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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Would people prefer it if we just called the threads "Social", "Strategic", and "Structural"? I'm not opposed, although we lose the thematic tiein. |
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| Medli | Apr 23 2018, 11:33:48 AM Post #51 |
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Neku for Smash!
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On the show, outlast could also just refer to living on a deserted island or wherever for over a month. |
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| Master Hand | Apr 23 2018, 11:37:46 AM Post #52 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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Fuck it, I'm doing it because I am mad with power. |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 11:40:51 AM Post #53 |
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I had thought Outlast, to be a very appropriate word to describe the Survivor game, but it is achieved by all finalists, by virtue of their making it to the end. But, Jeff had been interested in the branding, and utilizing the Survivor motto, so he had tried to force it into the FTC. I do not think, we need to use the same words here. |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 23 2018, 11:52:03 AM Post #54 |
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return of jared |
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| Isaac | Apr 23 2018, 12:21:52 PM Post #55 |
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I would just let them each have their own thread to ask questions honestly... i would be kinda pissed if i was on this jury and had this post restriction tbh. This is suppose to be the jurors moment and this feels... idk kinda meh. |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 12:58:26 PM Post #56 |
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i was reading the opening speeches thinking i liked ness's more than kirby's, and that just by the speeches, ness's game seemed as good as kirby's until i got to this:
yes it was a big decision, yes you thought hard about, and yes you voted out yoshi. i mean that was already self-evident. but WHY??? he doesnt say. why bring this action up if hes not going to explain it? hes just reminding the entire jury of one of his biggest blunders@ |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 01:03:24 PM Post #57 |
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lmao Fox's big post just roasting the rest of the jury, ftw.
Edited by Red Bulborb, Apr 23 2018, 01:04:59 PM.
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| Paper Luigi | Apr 23 2018, 01:11:01 PM Post #58 |
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Fox is the hero we all wanted |
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| Paper Luigi | Apr 23 2018, 01:12:06 PM Post #59 |
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but lmao I'm sure there's gonna be some popcorn popping and some bellies aching after that one |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 01:15:51 PM Post #60 |
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I think it's funny he spent so much time venting about his fellow jurors but I don't really like that he let the cat out of the bag about the likely outcome, it just makes ftc less fun (even though we all knew it already, and even though Kirby and Ness would have been able to pick up on the tenor of the questioning easily enough). I just dont like him doing away with even the pretense of any suspense
Edited by Red Bulborb, Apr 23 2018, 01:25:39 PM.
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| Galaxia Darkness | Apr 23 2018, 01:28:57 PM Post #61 |
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D3s questions are super strange? |
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 23 2018, 02:05:49 PM Post #62 |
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Certain people on this jury are ridiculously petty. I also feel as though if someone less popular than Fox in the MS community had made that post, the reaction would have been MUCH less positive here, because it infuriated me on so many levels.
Edited by Cardboard Box, Apr 23 2018, 02:06:09 PM.
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 23 2018, 02:11:10 PM Post #63 |
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So much this. Like, I was a bitter juror in my first game, but at least it was because I played like a paladin and was horrified at the concept of, gasp, betrayal! If you're being a schemey backstabber, you can't complain that you were outplayed by other schemey backstabbers. |
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| Crazy Hand | Apr 23 2018, 02:14:38 PM Post #64 |
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I get what you're saying. I can't vouch either way about Fox himself or the MS community. I know that Fox has had some need of personal contemplation and I asked him if he would come back to the forums and participate in the ending, not just with the FTC, but making sure he would be okay. It is petty, and you're right and validated in being infuriated at what he's written. However, I also understand his viewpoint as well since we had a couple discussions in which his comfort level had changed quite dramatically during this game. I'm proud of him for coming back, and not hiding what he has feeling inside. It's okay to be mad. It's okay to cry. It's okay to be happy. Just like I ask all of you constantly for your feedbacks and criticisms, I feel it's healthier to air grievances out loud. I'm not asking you to change your mind, just to think that our thoughts would be slightly different if we walked two moons in someone else's moccasins. |
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| Galaxia Darkness | Apr 23 2018, 02:23:00 PM Post #65 |
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I don't think casting fox is a wise idea for a while. I don't think anything is 'okay'. again, i think cardboard is me from another universe. A lot of fox's points seem to be 'he outplayed you so you..shouldn't vote for him'. I agree it took a while for me, as a juror, to reconcile the people who did me the most wrong probably outplayed me the best. |
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| Master Hand | Apr 23 2018, 02:45:18 PM Post #66 |
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An iron fist without the iron.
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Slow down, Kirby. You can be confident in front of a jury but you can't be cocky. |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 02:50:58 PM Post #67 |
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yeah the "Don't you dare say I lied" response to Mario isn't necessary or productive. I could see Ness possibly stealing Mario's vote to go with a potential Fox vote, and there could be another Ness vote somewhere too. But I still see three votes as Ness's maximum. We'll see! |
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| Red Bulborb | Apr 23 2018, 02:53:23 PM Post #68 |
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Like he really did receive that PM from Mario, so he's right in what he's saying, but he's being defensive about it instead of tactful. |
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| Crazy Hand | Apr 23 2018, 03:05:57 PM Post #69 |
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Also a very valid point. |
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| Amy | Apr 23 2018, 03:33:01 PM Post #70 |
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I don't have any problem with Fox's speech, I don't really disagree with any of it. But I also don't think he should be cast again for his own sake any time in the near future! |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 23 2018, 03:38:24 PM Post #71 |
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this is just juries |
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| Medli | Apr 23 2018, 03:45:26 PM Post #72 |
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Neku for Smash!
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When it comes down to it, who wins doesn't even matter. There's no prize waiting at the end, and either way the game's over. This is a game, the main objective is to have fun. FTCs as they are handled now almost always fail this objective for everyone involved. Maybe this is a terrible outlook to have, but I'd prefer to lose while having fun and playing a game I was proud of than win while feeling like I was crawling through hell to make it happen. Don't get me wrong, I do want to win, but if I do I want it to be on my terms. To be honest, the fact that most people appear to disagree with this sentiment is probably why the LSG scene here has gotten as big as it has, so maybe I'm wrong here, I don't know. There is so much I want to say here, but I just can't put it together into a cohesive post that wouldn't make me the bad guy here, so I'll stick with this for now. |
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| Medli | Apr 23 2018, 04:11:17 PM Post #73 |
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Neku for Smash!
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGMWL8cOeAU I'm just going to leave this here. It's a song from a video game soundtrack that always stood out to me. Take from it what you will. |
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| The President | Apr 23 2018, 04:23:48 PM Post #74 |
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I don't really buy the social game/strategic game as separate, honestly. I think a social game's purpose is to manipulate people into achieving your strategic goals. I would probably separate Survivor as a game into Challenges&Shit/Strategic/Tactical. Strategic being, what's your bootlist, who do you want to get out, will it get you to the end with someone beatable? And tactical being, how well can you communicate with others and make them like you in order to acheive that goal. |
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| Beast Ganon | Apr 23 2018, 04:40:48 PM Post #75 |
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how well can you ruthlessly backstab your allies at f6 |
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| The President | Apr 23 2018, 04:44:35 PM Post #76 |
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The general threshold for "is this jury bitter" is, do I agree with them? Thus, why Dawn got death threats instead of Brenda. |
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| The President | Apr 23 2018, 04:46:02 PM Post #77 |
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For what it's worth (nothing), I think Fox is right about how annoying Cap and Yoshi and others have been in the jury forum, and I don't disagree with the speech. I mean, I instinctively disagree with the tone because I avoid conflict like a mouse. |
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 23 2018, 04:58:10 PM Post #78 |
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Re: social game only being lubricant for your gamebot engine, I feel like you're underrating just how important being likable and fun to talk to is. I think it was Reck who called Survivor an emotional game with strategic trappings. People who are too cold and overtly backstabby get voted out because no one trusts them. That's why I can't be too mad some people are turned off by Kirby seeming a bit snaky, even if there's some hypocrisy involved.
Edited by Cardboard Box, Apr 23 2018, 05:06:32 PM.
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 23 2018, 05:00:56 PM Post #79 |
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I really don't think the jury was that bad backstage. They were discussing turns of events and maybe upselling their games a bit, but it's not like they were toxic or going, "you played an awful game, Chevre." Also, behaviour should not be judged morally by "will this get me death threats?" |
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| Cardboard Box | Apr 23 2018, 05:05:14 PM Post #80 |
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And I frankly don't think the sentiment behind it comes across as "you guys are behaving really badly" so much as "how dare you vote me out of the game and do better than me?", which I feel is a bit entitled and unfair to the other finalists and jurors, even if it's rooted in a lot of insecurity and unhappiness. |
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