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DiD Round V Chat
Topic Started: Jan 11 2017, 01:17 PM (2,648 Views)
Sakiri
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Jarl
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neildarkstar
Jan 23 2017, 12:32 AM
Oddly, Skyrim DOES have a viable hand to hand skill, it's just that it's invisible and can't actually be perked normally.

It's best for Khajiit chars , but If you get the gloves of the Pugilist, then disenchant them. Then if you take Heavy Armor and get the Fists of Steel perk, you can smith High level (Daedric or somesuch) gauntlets to a very high level, enchant them with a high level "fortify hand to hand" boost, and really get respectable damage out of punching someone in the head.
Don't need to smith them. Damage is based off base armor, not smithed armor rating.
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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Think my idea of "knight"... a non-magic using one.

1h
2h
block
heavy
archery
smithing
(speech
&
Lock-picking)

2h may not get more than a few perk's up the center... On Master
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Kane
Overlord
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Thinking about rolling a tank.

1h
Block
Heavy Armor
Archery
Smithing
Alteration
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glargg
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Jarl
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neildarkstar
Jan 23 2017, 12:32 AM
Oddly, Skyrim DOES have a viable hand to hand skill, it's just that it's invisible and can't actually be perked normally.

It's best for Khajiit chars , but If you get the gloves of the Pugilist, then disenchant them. Then if you take Heavy Armor and get the Fists of Steel perk, you can smith High level (Daedric or somesuch) gauntlets to a very high level, enchant them with a high level "fortify hand to hand" boost, and really get respectable damage out of punching someone in the head.
Well, that forces my "monk" to raise and perk Heavy Armor, which doesn't exactly work with the mental picture I have of a nimble martial arts monk.

I think it was very odd of Bethesda to remove hand-to-hand as a viable skill. I have a mod that puts it back in as a supplemental skill, raising hand-to-hand damage in accordance with player leveling, so that it does reasonable (but not OP) damage.
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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Glargg... as we are using mods... that one wouldn't be an issue... it would be an "advantage" mod over someone vanilla.. so a - but add in a + mod... and it lvl's out. All in all it does not sound like an advantage altogether though... as long as the damage levels according to vanilla scales.
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Sakiri
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Jarl
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I got two characters I'm rolling atm and have ideas for.

archery
sneak
alchemy
illusion
destruction
one handed

and

one hand
block
smithing
heavy armor
archery
sneak

Not 100% satisfied with the second setup but I couldn't think of a sixth skill and I usually sneak around dungeons.

Also not entirely sure if I want to stick with heavy armor. Being soooo sloooow without the steed stone or conditioning.....
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glargg
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Jarl
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Areial
Jan 23 2017, 12:32 PM
Glargg... as we are using mods... that one wouldn't be an issue... it would be an "advantage" mod over someone vanilla.. so a - but add in a + mod... and it lvl's out. All in all it does not sound like an advantage altogether though... as long as the damage levels according to vanilla scales.
Unfortunately, it's part of the "Classic Classes" mod, which puts classes back into Skyrim, and changes the starting skill levels. The mod adds 10 points to each of the six "class" skills, and deducts 10 points from other 12 skills. It then adds one special "class skill" to make classes unique (like hand-to-hand for Monks, or a small damage buff for Warriors.)

That wouldn't be a problem, I think, if this were an open all-skill competition, but it would be a major advantage in a situation where all six "class skills" were the chosen skills in a skill-limited round.

If there were a mod that just made hand-to-hand viable, I agree that it would not be an advantage over using a weapon, but I don't know of a mod that does just that.
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glargg
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Jarl
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I'm thinking of doing an "Archer/Ranger" for this round.

Archery
1-Handed (dual wield)
Light Armor
Alchemy
Smithing
Sneak
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Kane
Overlord
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So, in keeping with the class builds, we restrict perking to only the chosen skills?
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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Grandmaster -true unarmed and armored combat

Hand to hand- a true unarmed mod

New Unarmed Hand to hand

none of them look perfect.. I'm not sure which I would use.. if I wanted an unarmed character.. but it makes being unarmed and armored more viable...
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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Kane
Jan 23 2017, 02:04 PM
So, in keeping with the class builds, we restrict perking to only the chosen skills?
Yeah...with penalties for using other tree's... cause otherwise you just get someone that will use all of them. "you" chose them.. "you" stick to 'um.....
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glargg
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Jarl
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Areial
Jan 23 2017, 02:08 PM
Grandmaster -true unarmed and armored combat

Hand to hand- a true unarmed mod

New Unarmed Hand to hand

none of them look perfect.. I'm not sure which I would use.. if I wanted an unarmed character.. but it makes being unarmed and armored more viable...
Yeah, they're like so many mods out there, that do more than the simple thing you want to do.

What I'd like is to simply increase hand-to-hand base damage by one point per point of player level, and make no other changes to the game. That's what the monk's class skill does in "Classic Classes."

I think I'm going to have to make my own mod for that. :)

Edit: In thinking about it, I suppose I could accomplish the same thing by using the mod to create the class, and then by using console commands to set the starting skills back to vanilla. :)
Edited by glargg, Jan 23 2017, 02:21 PM.
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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True that...not perfect, but make's the class viable... and I read the read-me's... look's like unarmed has issues, that make it a problem...
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glargg
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Jarl
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Areial
Jan 23 2017, 02:25 PM
True that...not perfect, but make's the class viable... and I read the read-me's... look's like unarmed has issues, that make it a problem...
Yeah, I think that the main problem is that the game doesn't treat it like a skill, so modders have to do workarounds to get it to level up like other skills.
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Areial
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Et'Ada
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glargg
Jan 23 2017, 02:30 PM
Areial
Jan 23 2017, 02:25 PM
True that...not perfect, but make's the class viable... and I read the read-me's... look's like unarmed has issues, that make it a problem...
Yeah, I think that the main problem is that the game doesn't treat it like a skill, so modders have to do workarounds to get it to level up like other skills.
yup, pretty much what it sounded like... bummer that... but at least some moder's are able to do work around's.
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Kane
Overlord
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Poncho
Jan 22 2017, 06:19 PM
Loooooooooong post incoming.....

Kane
Jan 11 2017, 02:49 PM
Hmm, how about these to start:

Battlemage
-One handed
-Heavy Armor
-Restoration
-Destruction
-Enchanting

Archer
-Archery
-Light Armor
-One handed
-Smithing
-Alchemy

Scout
-One handed
-Shield
-Smithing
-Archery

Knight
-Two handed
-Heavy Armor
-Smithing
-Restoration

?


Areial
Jan 12 2017, 01:26 AM
Light armor... ( Oblivion classes)

Barbarian: Armorer ( smith )Athletics, Blade, Block, Blunt, Hand-to-Hand, Light Armor

Rogue: Alchemy, Athletics, Blade, Block, Illusion, Light Armor, Mercantile ( speech?)

Archer: Armorer, Blade, Blunt, Hand-to-Hand, Light Armor, Marksman,Sneak

Monk: Security, Sneak, Acrobatics, Marksman, Alteration, Hand-to-Hand, Athletics

Nightblade: Acrobatics, Alteration, Athletics, Blade, Destruction, Light Armor, Restoration

Spellsword: Major: Block, Restoration, Long Blade, Destruction, Alteration
Minor skills: Blunt Weapon, Enchant, Alchemy, Medium Armor, Axe

I think the biggest problem with some of the builds is that they don't have craft's in them, because you could buy those thing's that you needed in Oblivion.. need armor tempered.. smith does it for you...enchant and item... scrolls, staff's...etc.





Kane
Jan 12 2017, 11:41 PM
Light armor, sneak, archery, pickpocket, lockpicking, and illusion makes a perfect thief build.


After Dark
Jan 15 2017, 02:15 PM
Since you're talking about block, i just had an idea of a "Vanguard" class:
One-handed
Block
Heavy Armor
Alteration - defensive buffs
Illusion - for courage - defensive buffs for allies and frenzy - taunt (this is the closest i could find to those abilities)


glargg
Jan 15 2017, 02:35 PM
Possible "Sorcerer/Conjurer" class:

Conjuration, Armor (either), 1 Hand, Archery, Enchanting

Uses both bound weapons and summoned help; no physical weapons.


Brambleberry
Jan 15 2017, 02:54 PM
*snip*

a character could approach it as a peacemaker (even though we, behind the :joe: , know there will be no peace without some red stuff flying around). They'd have to adapt to the inevitable, but that wouldn't necessarily mean they'd have to do the bonking-on-the-head when they could just get someone else to do it. :evil:

Illusion, Old Rusty Sword (for those oh crap moments), shield, light armor, enchant/smith as an example.

*snip*

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Example: Warrior (no magic)
1. Heavy Armor
2. 2-hand
3. Block
4. Archery
5. Smithing
6. Enchanting
(speech)
(lock picking)

Example: Shield Mage
1. Illusion
2. Destruction
3. Block
4. Light Amor
5. Smithing
6. Enchanting
(speech)
(lock picking)


*all septims left in a post are subject to collection by Grits :)


Brambleberry
Jan 15 2017, 08:35 PM
Build Suggestions
RangerSpellbladePaladinSquishy Mage
1. Archery1. Conjuration1. Two-Handed1. Destruction
2. Sneak2. One-handed or 2-handed (you chose one of these)2. Heavy Armor2. Illusion
3. One-handed3. Restoration3. Block3. Alteration
4. Block4. Block4. Restoration4. Conjuration
5. Light Armor5. Light Armor5. Enchanting5. Alchemy
6. Alchemy6. Enchanting6. Smithing6. Enchanting
(speech)(speech)(speech)(speech)
(lock picking)(lock picking)(lock picking)(lock picking)


Thought I'd put a few out there just for kicks. These are just suggestions and can be morphed to suit one's desires. :D


Sakiri
Jan 22 2017, 04:06 PM
Do we have a list of the classes? Or do I have to go back through the other pages still.


I think I got everything...though if there are any I missed they can be reposted below
So, we couple all that with this:

---------------------------

Joining the Legion/Stormcloaks
The Jagged Crown
Message to Whiterun
Battle for Whiterun


Reunification of Skyrim (Imperials)
-A False Front
-The Battle for Fort Dunstad
-Compelling Tribute
-The Battle for Fort Greenwall
-Rescue from Fort Kastav
-The Battle for Fort Amol
-Battle for Windhelm

Liberation of Skyrim (Stormcloaks)
-Rescue from Fort Neugrad
-Compelling Tribute
-The Battle for Fort Sungard
-A False Front
-The Battle for Fort Snowhawk
-The Battle for Fort Hraggstad
-Battle for Solitude

Thane of...
-The Rift
-The Reach
-The Pale
-Falkreath
-Whiterun
-Winterhold
-Hjaalmarch
-Haafingar
-Eastmarch

No other factions, no Main Quest beyond 'Dragon Rising'

-----------------------

And then it's just a matter of points, length, and multipliers.
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Brambleberry
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Jarl
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Trying to wrap my head around this, we are 1) limited to leveling up our 6 skills and the 2 freebies. 2) Any leveling beyond 2 oopsie skill raises of other skills starts giving a penalty. 3) We are free to do any quests, but only those to be outlined will count for points. For example, I can do bounties and such without penalty, but only CW and those other completions like becoming Thane count for points. 4) Mods are allowed and should be posted as part of the build post, so we can collectively evaluate them for future modded competition/build runs. 5) It is mandatory that we have FUN! :teehee:

Is that a fair general (very general) assessment of the direction we are heading?

``````
"No other factions, no Main Quest beyond 'Dragon Rising'" - not sure I agree with this. Why can't we be, for example, a member of the Dark Brotherhood and still complete the required competition goals, or a member of the CoW and do the same. We just wouldn't get any points for doing those things.

The reason I bring this up, is that some may want certain armors, artifacts or weapons for their particular build and many are behind a faction or daedric quest. I think providing the flexibility of play without giving points for going outside the goals is reasonable, What do others think?

Edited by Brambleberry, Jan 23 2017, 03:05 PM.
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Kane
Overlord
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Aye aye, Brammy! :banana:

---------------------------
Well, reason I had it like that it is because I originally envisioned using faction specific gear. Of course that is a problem in and of itself, since vanilla Stormies don't have a heavy armor variant. So, that's definitely out the window.

It just seems like a detriment to the Hero of Skyrim idea, if the hero is also a member of the assassin or thieves cults, ya know?
Edited by Kane, Jan 23 2017, 03:12 PM.
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Kane
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Round V: The Champion of Cyrodiil Skyrim!
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glargg
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Jarl
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Well, it seems to me that banning the joining of other factions doesn't work. For example, if one is playing a magey type, one would need access to the CoW for some spells that can't be gotten elsewhere.

Also, regarding the MQ only to Dragon Rising, what about a character who relies on shouts? Unrelenting Force is pretty puny without all three words.

I can see giving no credit/points for those quests/factions, but I don't get banning them.
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