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| Sam)(ael | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 4 2009, 03:37 AM (637 Views) | |
| Sam)(ael | Apr 16 2009, 02:47 PM Post #76 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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You Know Master Silmerion, I don't know how you manage to be so supportive. It must be a special capacity or something you have worked on. After EVERY post I make I find your encouragment and that you have actually read the whole thing and I find sincerity that seems lost on the world a lot these days. It strikes me as a magnification of one of Jesus' own traits shining through you. I am Sure he loves you a lot for that and other things. How could I not? I am Grateful for you Silmerion. My great feats all seem to be trapped... Crystalized in the future for the moment, but yours are every day right before my face, and I can't help but appreciate it all. Thanks. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 16 2009, 02:53 PM Post #77 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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Knight Assignment 7 I am glad to report that I have completed the Knight scripture memorization block. I have been working since I became a knight and it wasn't easy but it was definitely easier than the last group. I think I am getting better. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 16 2009, 04:13 PM Post #78 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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Knight Assignment 8
Alright! A way stimulating assignment atop many stimulating ones! I am choosing Luke Skywalker as my model for this report. His own struggles are very similar and I also share a lot of the particular views that end up being presented through him in the fiction novels and other presentations that are at least book-canon. Lets look at the begining for a start. The very begining. Luke was born to a Father who was arguably one of the most gifted and possibly (in sheer potential and power) most powerful men ever to enter the galaxy. He was born to a mother who managed to keep up with his father and even stay clearly ahead on her wits and wisdom alone. He was not born alone but as a twin to a girl later named leia. Anakin Skywalker and Padme's love had to be kept secret but it blossomed despite the measured self restraints of the powerfully willed Padme and despite Anakin's strict Jedi training. From the Start, Luke and Leia's Existence and what lead to it was opposed it seemed by the entire Galaxy. The penalties were harsh but seemingly in the desert, love flourished and so Luke and Leia's pedigree suggests several things in both their children, including luke. -A strong will -Boldness bordering on brashness -A Heritage of immense power (Not just through the force) -Love -Seemingly a challenge against the entire galaxy from the get-go. -We could also presume that from the beginning his heritage was out of line with the Jedi order. His Father too old and born to a slave He himself also too old by the time he met Master Yoda. Heritage His crowning event in pre-birth heritage was the intense conflict surrounding his entire life. His father had questioned the Jedi, followed his heart, and in the process been twisted into a tool of an Evil Sith Lord. All very dangerous things to do. All seemingly taboo. His mother was the motivation for much of what caused this and inside herself she to was conflicted. Never doubting her love, but knowing in her sweet but prematurely wise heart that all such things had to eventually be paid for. Worse yet was the conflict of love versus duty and the terror of her love turned to darkness. The tragedy that marked his life and sent him on his course was one that occured almost as a private show to a small audience of three on Mustafar, but it's shrieking pains and the shudder of the galaxy could and should have shaken the Galaxy, for all of the notes of purity and loss were sung as few events could ever have been. A fantastic trek throught the galaxy centered upon love and hopes and fears. This had not been replicated or forshadowed regardless of a thousand years of galactic trauma. Birth Luke's birth was his last moment with his mother, later he recalls that he has no memory of his mother, something he regrets and we can see he longs for it. One must think when reviewing the whole story from a son's perspective how much internal need for his parents luke must have had and what a miracules and difficult miracle all in one he was able to pull off in the End with his father, who was once again stolen from him by a fate that seemed anonymously against the Skywalker family from the beginning. Though these events were seemingly small. Though the longings could easily be set aside for bigger things. I must conclude from my own perspective and thought, that no other thing could have weighed more on the outcome, or Identified the Character of Luke Skywalker more than a deep hunger for his family. He was truely a man who loved his parents but was forever divided from them. How he never complained is a wonder misunderstood. His aching was in his heart and it may never have been relieved until he died. Early Life Luke Skywalker was raised by his uncle (or half uncle somewhat removed) on a moisture farm out in the desert waists of Tatooine. We might draw a parallel between the humble birth of Jesus because very little could have been a less desireable and still honest living to be born into. Had he known any other world he may have died inside with such monotony and hoplessness, but it established very clean and basicly good roots in him. He never felt superior to others or above them. He had been a moisture farmer which ranked close to cleaning bantha pudu. From the Start we have hints of his piloting ability. He wanted to go off and talk piloting or possibly fly but his uncle was mostly concerned with business. Luke's vast potential was showing a few unsteady beams and at the beginning even these must have been sheer bursts of Joy getting away from the dry rock he lived on and it seemed he would never leave. His ability to fix droids was shown (like his father) early on when he seemed to have an opinion in R2-D2 and C3PO's purchase and also when he not only took care of their repairs and cleaning but in conversation with his uncle, Apparently his responsabilities also involved some droid and computer technology that helped the farming process. Despite all of this he was not content or shall I say because of all of this he was close to miserable and a little pessimistic. He made an honest living and his uncle was plenty happy it seemed just to do that, but luke wasn't. Not many teenagers would be I should guess, but you have to wonder if it meant more. Was the sheer size of his destiny looming over the mundane? Did he sense if nothing more the presence of great possability? Did he have to deal with doubts in his youth about his own value because he felt a greater call but waited for many years without even a hint of rescue? It might have lead to the Doubt he displayed with Yoda when the Jedi Master lifted the figher out of the swamp. A self doubt and not a doubt of the force. One can only conclude that the beginning of his maturing life started much like the movie title, but 'without' a new hope. At least until an eccentric old hermit called Ben Kenobi saved his life and removed the 'without' tag on it. This is where he learned the first real bits about his father and the first time he was able to make a direct link between the Jedi and his Father. You notice he had no trouble believing Kenobi's story despite him being an eccentric old hermit up until it came to him using the force or basically doing anything himself. It seems he might have been fairly desperate to leave beside the murder of his family. As for his possible doubts... His brash father kept him from complaining but he may have had some real douts only aggravated by his mother's older-than-she-looked wisdom. Early Jedi Training Though Luke never is seen in the movies asking to be trained by kenobi it seems he apprenticed himself to Kenobi in a very light manner. Something like a youngling learning from a master at the temple. Perhaps it was only experiments to Luke's thoughts but it was certainly training to kenobi and it started with the basics of the force and the Lightsaber. Possibly two of his most necessary and lacking tools for what was to come. It didn't Seem like Kenobi taught him all that much about actually being a Jedi until after Kenobi had become a Ghost. His instructions were not teaching almost at all unless you count explaining some things which he did little of with regards to Jedi and the force. It seemed more like Kenobi was transporting him and that is how they fell into the hands of the empire until finally he had to sacrifice himself to save luke. Possibly Luke was being transported to Yoda, possibly he was simply being taken to a his sister. Perhaps he was being taken to a private sanctuary for training. Who really knows. It was not explained. Years of Maturation Luke's personality was brash like his father at first scratch but he could be made to look and with a little more patience his mother's insight and innate wisdom was equally in effect as long as he remained calm. Both aspects benefitted him greatly in his life but at first they played at odds. During the first attack on the death-star his journey to maturity had taken a flash-flood journey. He found a cause. It was Challenging and it was worth it. Perhaps he had never been personally wounded by the Empire's evil besides with Kenobi's death but he felt the call and he excelled. His new hope was fully underway and the journey to maturity with it. During the empire strikes back, Luke was busy with the rebellion's work. He was learning and practicing skills as a warrior and leader and his close friends Leia and Han helped him to expand on a few things. Leadership because he had become a face in the rebellion and because both Han and Leia were natural leaders. Patience at least some with han and much acceptance as well as how to work well with people. He was also being knit in tight with a group of what we can assume are pretty good men fighting for freedom when it was really unpopular to do so. At least unpopular for the people who liked living. His personality expanded a lot with experience and brotherhood and purpose. Instead of the strictures of the Jedi holding him back he was allowed every good tool he had and a cause that used them all to the brim and sometimes demanded more. The structure of the situation was very healthy and it forged his identity or at least had the process well-begun. During this pert of his life he started to clearly identify himself as a good person. The Years of Maturation piqued and he could be said to have ended that leg of his trip when he is seen for the first time in return of the Jedi at Jabba's palace. His confidence and determination had become full, his patience and gravity had centered. He was truely a Jedi at this point and nothing could disuade this fact. He had become an adult. Becoming a Jedi Though until he met Yoda, luke had never asked to become a Jedi he had been on that course from the beginning. Perhaps it was an irrisistable course for him, a way of learning things his father knew must have been a tasty tempter. We do know that he continued to exercise as he had been taught all the way up until he finally met Yoda and became an apprentice. At first in the empire strikes back luke has become busy fighting for the rebellion, when in a horrible situation Ben Kenobi tells him to go to Yoda who will teach him. A call from the Jedi returns him to his course. He proceeds as close to immediately as he can and as soon as the battle at Hoth ended he split with the fleet and headed to the vastly populated planet of dagobah. Somehow (we will leave it to luck or unseen instruction) he landed just an easy walk from Yoda's house. There the Jedi Master using his size and appearance to test the young man purposly played the crazy old hermit and Luke's impatience showed Yoda some serious problems to watch out for. He allowed the training however and it began in earnest. Much can be brought from Yoda's influence on Luke, but what must have had some of the most lasting effects were that Yoda impressed upon Luke that nothing was impossible and may have taught Luke to truely rely upon the force in a way his doubt had made hard to do. "A Jedi's strength Flows from the force". Was a Common Yoda line. When Luke was faced with the decision to save his friends or stay back and complete the training, his irrationality paid off though the nearness of his failure was so close it cannot be considered a victory so much as a lucky turn to a badly matched face-off. He faced vader as he thought the Sith Lord to be which meant he did not truely confront his father up until he leapt from the extension and fell through cloud city exiting at the bottom. His flawless trust of his friends paid off in a clear victory with his escape and he was left with a taste he knew must be true though he had no reason to believe. Luke had Just met his father and his worst nightmare. His world turned on its side. His doubts didn't need to exist for him to plunge into complete confusion. He spent quite a while between the 2nd and 3rd movies focusing on tracking down Han Solo and arranging his freedom. It is probably impossible that he did not think long and carefully to himself on his family and especially himself and Vader and his father. Was there a reconciling point or was he being tricked? By the time of the Return of the Jedi he had matured and recovered mostly, he had only one more thing he had to know. Now that Han was free he returned to Yoda to train, he learned two things. He was ready but must confront Vader, and Vader... Was his father. His world so recently settled now orbited in two worlds circling each other. In order for him to be a Jedi he mst face Vader which ment destroy him as far as Yoda was concerned. In order to be whole he needed his father. One of them needed to be at the center and both could not fit in the same space it seemed. His life consisted of two opposite truths he could not reconcile. Faced with impossabilities his training under Yoda and His father's boldness, and his mother prophetic last words probably all helped him create an impossible plan. To convert his father back. To fight for something he loved. To risk everything on compassion and love and need. It was not a foolish move with either outcome considered so much as it was a need. A faith beyond faith that he was willing to dedicate every particle he had to. And he won out in the end. Later Years After piling a funeral pire adnd placing his father's armor and perhaps his body on it luke had to say goodbye to his hard-fought prize. Even knowing how much good he had done in saving his father could not have silenced the loss. Years later with no Empire to fight he turned his sights to Yoda's request. To teach what he had learned, and he did. In addition to revitalizing and bringing peace to the republic many times and in many decisive battles he found and taught as much as he possibly could. Though the Jedi (for better or worse) would never be the shiny elegant group they had been their work would never be more gratefully felt by the Galaxy. Luke Skywalker became a Jedi Master and had to re-forge the way to many truths and particles of deep wisdom. He set a standard and for many years was the one Master holding the Jedi together through a host of the most varied and sometimes ridiculous problems. All in all, his path could have been changed at any time. I have repeatedly mentioned times wen his doubts could have shifted hit foot just one inch to much. He behaved admirably. He chose wisely. He fought well, and he was not afraid to deviate from the 'normal' way in exchange for the right way. For that, he is a heroic figure to me. |
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| Silmerion Skywalker | Apr 17 2009, 03:18 AM Post #79 |
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Master Consular/Scholar/Healer
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Thank you for your kind words Samael. I always enjoy reading your Assignments, they are very interesting and often present things with a new light. I consider you as a great Jedi and an awesome friend, I'll be always there for you. You did a great work on your Assignments. I really admire Luke too, also for the fact that though he had inside the same "fire" Anakin had, he didn't react with rage when his uncle and aunt died, they had raised him, so I believe they were like parents for him, and he didn't even seem to strive for personal revenge, he just followed Ben, probably feeling that this was his path. He was surely grieving but he didn't focus on himself, he thought of helping the galaxy, even when he lost Ben. His love, compassion and forgiveness went as far as saving his father, refusing to fight, which could have meant dying. He loved until the end, like Jesus. Now that you have written this Assignment on Luke, I'm not sure I made a work on myself to be "supportive" or if I only strived to follow his example. When I lost my father, I felt rage, like Anakin but with God's help, I've always been convinced that love was the right way, and in that Trial, the Skywalker family helped me much to understand. Master Silmerion |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 17 2009, 02:16 PM Post #80 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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No one comforts like Jesus. That is for sure. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 17 2009, 08:29 PM Post #81 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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Knight Assignment 9
I have chosen two characters for their contrasts rather than simularities. This ought to be interesting. Moses and Darth Sidious. I am going to pick some specific topics to detail my report on instead of comparing life times chronologically. Birth and Parents (Heritage) Sidious' origins are not known. So much so that it is possible to speculate on whether he ever existed outside of the Sith. Somehow he missed being identified by the Jedi for his Force abilities Much as Moses narrowly avoided execution by the Egyptians and these similar events for both of them made all the difference in their lives. One thing that is known is that he was thought to be of noble blood on Naboo (if that was truely his birth place). This is an exact reverse to Moses' own birth to humble slaves of the hebrew race in Egypt. Though later moses rose to power because of his adoptive egyptian parents, palpatine started out powerful. While Moses rose in stature very quickly, outdoing the egyptians in planning and managing the Slaves, Palpatine or sidious we should say, spent his time hiding his skills making repeated and obvious misses at grabbing power so that he always looked like no threat and even a laughable presence to other politicians. One might also look at their hidden identities which both originated in their youth. Palpatine (if that was even his real identity) spent a third of his life (if not all of it) concealing who he really was, while Moses' own true identity was kept from him for a similar period of time though he was all the time unknowing. Being Raised Moses' time being raised was one of privilege. He was considered a prince of Egypt and a powerful man. His resources were plenteous and his education must also have been that way. To the Best of our knowledge he grew with God's grace upon him and became a good and powerful man as he matured. Sidious' own period of being raised to adulthood can be speculated as mostly being his time spent with Darth Plagues a period that is thought to have been several decades. It can be assumed that in some sith fashion as with Darth Maul Sidious was found and recruited by Plagues as a child or young adult and spent his youth training in sith ways. The atmosphere was far different from Moses' situation. His training was considered some of the most harsh and painful training ever given by the Sith but it successfully forged Sidious into one of the most powerful Sith lords since Darth Bane. Both Men grew in power and strength very well and it might also be seen as similar that both men soon outgrew their homes. Moses soon realizing he could not be a prince of such a wicked people and being driven out for his benevolent actions toward the hebrew (resulting in an Egyptian death). Sidious fearing his own replacement murdered his own master. The acts that set them off into their adulthood should also be contrasted. Fear and murder, benevolence and insight. Quite a parallel on different sides of the spectrum. Heirs to Power Though Moses was not exceptionally gifted with a power called the force, it can be seen quite evident through his whole story that the Lord was with him and had a purpose for his life, perhaps from the beginning. It was similar to Sidious' own power though the strength was in the force and the darkness alighted on him at a presumably young age. Teachings that shaped their lives Moses' lessons in his schooling (as we can assume because of the great Egyptian learning in science and mathmatics he had it) was not to be of a leading nature. His brother soon to be pharoah was the one being prepared for the seat as the god-king or Egypt while Moses was taught and prepared to lead as a second. His responsabilities had also become very different towards the end of his time as a prince of Egypt. His lessons as we can see them must have happened through insight and inspirations in his own heart. The great spite and unkindness to the hebrews could not have been easy to avoid and to him it must have nurtured a goodness rather than an evil to see such things. It is entirely possible that his most important lesson was to look for what was right despite what was common or popular. The Second part of Moses' Education came from his first and many of his following experiences with God. He leared for a surety that there is a God. He learned the Value of Work in his time away from Egypt. He learned of the matchless power of God and the obedience required as he began to follow the path God required of him. His last section of life-changing lessons were about the wickedness of men. He watched with what must have been ever-increasing agony as the (aptly named) children of isreal displayed their inability to be even minorly obedient and did foolish things regularly until Moses himself was taken from them. Sidious on the other hand learned a few lessons that varied widely and were perhaps less truthful. Somewhere in his training with his master he learned some very wrong things. He emerged with a severe racism and a hatred that could be the emotion most attributed to his power. He learned the foolishness of men much like moses but from the point of view of a predator. Sidious learned about 'unlimited' power in a personal opposite of Moses' enlightenment by the lord. Sidious hatched his own great plans while moses obeyed the lord's plans. You could say though, that while moses' first lesson was compassion, Sidious trapped in the bowels of darkness (perhaps willingly) eventually learned bitter hatred for all. And that has made all the difference as their paths begin to seperate more and more. Defining characteristics and habits/mannerisms Moses' life has been characterized Probably to his own credit by compassion wheras Sidious's actions and goals were framed with bitterness and hatred. Both were industrious exceeding the expectations placed upon them in many cases and accomplishing a work which the Galaxy would never have thought possible. Both had considerable power vested in them though they came from different perspectives, one inner and one as a removable gift. Sidious loved mechanations and plans where Moses was only a servant obeying the plan set out by the Father. Sidious was a politician at heart and it was clear he must have loved his work there. Moses could hardly speak for himself, to the point where his brother Aaron had to do so for him. Both were also symbols of the sides they were on, made larger than life by the forces represented. Goals and Great works Moses was quickly brought to face his purpose as Given him almost from and by birth to free the Children of Israel from Egypt. Sidious created his own plan but could just as easily have been pointed on his way by his surrounding elements toward the destruction of the Jedi and the Revenge of the Sith. Both participated in works that blew the mind and which none would have guessed was possible until the end. End of their lives You can clearly see a difference in their ends. Moses was taken away from the Children of Israel for their wickedness. His authority from God was above what they were capable of since they were truely the equivilent of big children. With his removal came the Law of moses. A set of baby-step laws dictating every small detail of the law and the punishment for the children of israel so that they would obey the lower law. Moses had fulfilled his assignment and his death was neither his own choice or the way nature might have done it. When his work had ended, the lord recieved him to Himself. Sidious was anything but natural also,, but certainly not Good or Godly. Depending on when you wish to place his death (His spirit inhabited a clone at one point six years after Darth vader destroyed him the first time) you could still say that either way Sidious died through betrayal. His own apprentice threw him off of a ledge into the depths of the death star at one point, and one of his royal guards sabotaged his clones later which helped him perish the second time. Either way his death was not a good thing for him and his own evil deeds surely caught up with him. Closing Remarks I have found surprising simularity between Sidious and Moses up until you look at what they were doing. The structure of their lives seems to have followed basic themes and problems. This has lead me to re-discover just how similar the situations Good and Bad people find themselves in. It reminds me that what we choose to do and choose to believe are still the most important parts of who we are. Take it from the Examples of (Arguably) the greatest Sith Lord ever and a Prophet of God who did some of the most fantastic miracles found in the old testament. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 17 2009, 08:36 PM Post #82 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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I have also completed the 11th Knight Assignment (Learning the Lord's Prayer in Aramaic) which was an interesting exercise. I don't really go in for mantra's or repeated prayers. If I need strength or focus I remind myself that there is no distraction or I ask for the Strength I need from the Lord. That being Said I have heard the prayer spoken in Aramaic before from a Church Vidio and saying it myself certainly adds some understanding. Its strange that it does but it makes me feel more like I was in that time and when I think about the Savior in the Garden of Gethsemany taking the sins of the world upon himself so that I could be saved, it adds a little and makes me feel closer to him. See a little clearny what might have happened at that most important of moments in the history of the world. It has been a good experience. |
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| Silmerion Skywalker | Apr 18 2009, 04:05 AM Post #83 |
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Master Consular/Scholar/Healer
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Your choice of characters is really interesting, it is very thought-provoking to think of Sidious and Moses' lives. You made an awesome work. I agree that our choices define what we are, especially choosing to follow God (or spirituality) or some more material and selfish path. This choice doesn't involve only ourselves but also the world around us, Sidious was a disaster for the whole galaxy while Moses was a blessing for humanity. I'm glad you liked learning the Lord's Prayer in Aramaic, it was also an awesome experience for me, and saying it each day in Jesus's language makes me always feel closer to Him. Master Silmerion |
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| Kai Stormwalker | Apr 18 2009, 06:11 AM Post #84 |
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Master Sentinel/Scholar/Healer
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I think of Pharisees as the ultimate conservatives. Like the Religious Right of today they were preserving something that started out as coming from God, but became perverted when man added his own "traditions." Jesus drove the moneychangers out of the temple not because they were wicked, but because, one, they were ripping off the poor; and two, he had come to establish a system where grace could not be bought. You don't seem to understand what the laws of God are about. They are about establishing a community where everyone has enough food, health care (Jesus was the original proponent of universal health care as he sent his disciples out to heal anyone who needed healing), and shelter. In Deuteronomy it was established that every seven years people debts were to be forgiven. This was to keep the poor from being overwhelmed by debt, and to keep the rich from becoming greedy. I don't know of many conservatives who would agree to something like this today. I actually consider Jesus to be a perfect liberal. He called for people to question the status quo and to re-think a better life. A life that transcended the Law. The life that God originally intended for us; free of the Law and based on compassion and love for everyone. After Jesus death and resurrection, his Holy Spirit was poured out on the whole world. Not just on those who believe in him, but everyone. And there are people all over the world who are living in accord with that Spirit whether they consider themselves to be Christians or not. I do believe in right and wrong. I believe maliciously taking another person's life is a sin. Therefore, anyone who goes into the military and kills another human being has committed a sin. However, I believe that releasing someone from a life of pain and suffering can be an act of the greatest compassion. But, you also have to be willing to face the earthly consequences. True right and wrong is all about the effects on others. That is what the entire Bible is about. Right and wrong merely for the sake of right and wrong is meaningless. And is therefore, wrong. And this isn't about opinion, it is about following the Holy Spirit which transcends the Law. I am a liberal, and I love Jesus so much, and believe so strongly in the Bible, that I cannot stand the way they have been perverted. If Jesus came today proclaiming the good news, he would once again be declared a blasphemer and condemned by the religious right. Jesus didn't come to start a new religion. He came to teach us how to live together in compassion. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 18 2009, 10:43 PM Post #85 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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Wow, That was a thought I hadn't had before. Pharisees as conservatives. Its an apt model of conservatism gone horribly wrong isn't it? Some of the filthiest sinners in all time, those wicked enough to crucify their own God were powerful Concervatives in their way. I Think there was more to Jesus' motives when he drove off the money changers and others. He specifically mentioned some of it when he talked to the Pharisees (who rushed to question his actions) about "my father's house". Lets not take our entrenched sides. I am interested in good which to my understanding translates in part into a Conservative political view. You are also primarily interested in good and it has become a liberal application. Obviously both Liberalism and Conservatism can be taken too far and two good people can see the evil on both sides. We are still on the same side thought we believe in different methods toward the mostly same end. I am a staunch conservative and I would go for whatever Jesus set up. I am about to make a covenant to give any of my substance to the lord should it be requested. That is everything including the skin off my back. There is not much greed in that is there? A little more dedicated than just forgiving debts every seven years. I see conservatism as the right way because it maintains our rights to choose our own religion etc. governments and socialism are notorious for establishing their own false gods or promoting atheism or worse if you look at Hitler's worship of things occult. I think maintaining our freedoms from the governmnent's nature (which is so easily prone to take freedom into it's own hands) is my responsability. Change is great. Change happens. I am not resisting good changes, in fact I go Vote for them with my preciously defended freedoms. I listen to the Spirit and make the best choices I can. That could sum up all of my political views in the end which I think is your basic aproach as well. I disagree about Laws a bit. Jesus ended the Law of moses when he came (as the prophets fortold) but he brought us a higher law to replace it. The 'Big kids' set of rules that he tried to give the children of israel on the stone tablets. A law so much higher than man was used to but no less strict. Instead of 'an eye for an eye' it was 'Turn the other cheek, forgive them that despitefully use you, and bless your enemies.' Love thy neighbor. Love the Lord before men. Instead of 'Thou shalt not kill' the higher law demanded us not even to spend time in hatred or in coveting or in lust and jealousy. We now were to control not just our actions, but our feelings, our thoughts, and our desires. God put us in a world where hunger happens. Where worse things than we should talk about here happen statistically three times a second in Arizona where I live. We should do all we can to ease the burdens of others, but they also serve for trials that the lord uses to test and strengthen us. If God was against all pain he could have stopped it without any need of our help. Adversity helps us to fulfil our purpose here on earth. It will continue to manifest as long as it is needed. It is up to us to teach the gospel and strengthen our neighbors through their adversities. Often Adversity helps people to become humble and return to the proper worship of the being from whom all things truely come. Adversity is healthy. Look at plants and animals who have no adversity in their lives. They languish and die. Plenty of scientists have replicated an experiment where a few rats were placed in two enviroments. One was dangerous and cats were allowed to prowl regularly. Food was somewhat limited and/or hard to reach. In the other enviroment there was unlimited food (always replenished) and no obstacles. All was easily available. One colony thived and did well. The other colony ended up eating each other, destroying all of their materials, and nearly anihilating their race from their enviroment. Which soared in numbers and retained healthy members of the race? Which perished in self-consumption? Sadly, the rats with the easy life were the ones who eventually (and needlessly) literally ate each other, killed their young, and became severely unhealthy and unfit. The others produced stronger individuals and communities the harder things were made. Which group of rats do you think we are most like? Are you afraid? Life is easy. God isn't interested in Jellyfish followers. We not only have the ability but the responsability to be valiant in our service to Him. God wants more Peters. More Rocks upon which he can place his will to be accomplished. Back to politics. I think Capitolism gives us our best shot at that since it favors those who build their fortunes on work. Good hard Work is something I believe comes from God. I believe its a system that favors no man and thus is equal with all keeping the greedy at least for the most part equal and fightable. Even if some people are left out those who have substance to spare can give to others. I myself fast monthly and give money for meals to the poor. I also give 10% of all money I earn to the Lord to build His church with. Its a system with conservative rules that will perfect the human organism as it takes root. No other organization was better able to serve the victims of hurrican Katrina. Take that and other examples for thought. We were faster than the governmnet and other religious bodies. We also gave over a million dollars and helped rebuild parts of the city through volunteer work. Our stricter order allowed us to do things that more liberal groups apparently didn't meet. The system proves itself is all I am saying. With government... the slightest imbalance leads to an evil master who would never take your lives and make you slaves if he already worshipped God. Communism was a liberal idea gone overboard with the same goals you have Master Kai. The system didn't work either. The people starved while the evil leaders ignored them until the people finally tore their own gates down and ended the suffering. Probably by taking life. |
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| Silmerion Skywalker | Apr 19 2009, 02:59 AM Post #86 |
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Master Consular/Scholar/Healer
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I have to say that as a Catholic I may have leaned toward Conservative principles in the past, but with time and with strengthening my relationship with Jesus, I understood the need of Liberalism. Master Kai's thoughts opened my eyes on many things and allowed me to know Jesus better. I prayed and meditated a lot, and God's answer to me was always the same: love, compassion. Capitalism today seems to be mostly based on a few persons who have so much money and make the others work. Today not everybody can find a job and sometimes, in order to get one or to maintain one, we should make choices against morality, which I always refused, reason why I don't have a stable work. Communism may have had good basical ideas but then human greed corrupted it too... I think that as Jesus's followers we should strive to imitate his actions, healing, giving food to those who are hungry, visiting those who are in jail, giving to those who have nothing...loving. I don't think any political system can really fully work, because we are sinners and power can corrupt easily. I always think of the ideal of Camelot, a perfect kingdom who was destroyed because human aren't perfect... I believe that we should start to fill our own heart with compassion and pray that God can send us His Holy Spirit to guide us in anything we do. Master Silmerion |
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| Kai Stormwalker | Apr 19 2009, 07:38 AM Post #87 |
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Master Sentinel/Scholar/Healer
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When I first accepted Jesus as my savior I had very conservative beliefs. It was what I was taught. But eight years ago I began devoting myself to seeking God and asking him to reveal his truth to me. He did. And that is how I came to see how judgemental and ignorant I had been. He even showed me that I needed to repent and actually go to people (many non-believers) that I had wronged and ask for forgiveness. The two people who refused to forgive me were an LDS man and a woman who was always talking about what a good Christian she was. Capitolism is flawed because it favors those who build their fortunes on work. That goes against what Jesus taught and what his followers believed. And a certain ruler asked him, "Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?" Jesus said to him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone. You know the commandments:'you shall not murder; you shall not steal; you shall not bear false witness; honor your father and mother.'" He replied, "I have kept all these since my youth." When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "There is still one thing lacking. Sell all that you own and distribute the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then come, follow me." But when he heard this, he became sad; for he was very rich. Jesus looked at him and said, "How hard it is for those who have wealth to enter the kingdom of God. Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God. Luke 18:18-25 (The Eye of the Needle was the name of a narrow gate into Jerusalem. The only way a camel could be taken through was if its load was removed.) All who believed were together and had all things in common; they would sell their possessions and goods and distribute the proceeds to all, as any had need. Acts 2:44-45 Capitolism as it is practiced in the U.S. today is one of the direct causes of working class slavery. CEOs who make 400 times what their lowest paid worker makes is unconscionable. No one can live decently on minimum wage. In my church we believe that everyone has a gift that they can use for the benefit of all. Some make music, some paint pictures or tell stories, some provide encouragement and counsel, some can work with their hands, some can grow things, some are good at making money. We believe that those who produce tangible goods or make money are called to provide for those with less tangible gifts. When I told my neighbors about my churches plan to help the refugee community, those on both sides of me immediately offered to help. Neither of these people consider themselves to be Christians, but they are doing what Jesus called us all to do, so they are his followers. You say that conservatism allows people to choose their own religions. My church believes that Jesus didn't come to start a new religion, but a way of life. So we welcome people of all faiths and no faith to fellowship with us and join us in serving others. Also, you have it wrong when you say: It is the Holy Spirit alive within us that does these things. We cannot do it ourselves and we are arrogant to claim we can. And when Jesus said, For you always have the poor with you... Matthew 26:11 He wasn't saying that there was nothing they could do about it. He was saying that they were called to serve the poor everyday. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 20 2009, 07:52 AM Post #88 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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We are saying the same words, Liberal and Capitolism, and Conservative but I think we are seeing very different things. Liberalism according to Sam)(ael When I say liberalism is flawed I am talking about a lot of vaguely spiritual people who pretend to love god as long as it passes their political agendas. They suggest these ideas that support 'ME NOW' agendas. Ideas that put cash in people's hands right now, but basically rob them several years down the road for all they are worth. These people and ideas might even mean well! But the plan doesn't work for anyone but the politicians or a few people who quietly pocket money when you add the dollars and cents. Whether that is leberalism or not. When That type of thing happens I resist and attempt to stop it as best I can and I call it leberalism whatever it might be called to you. Is that fair? Capitolism according to Sam)(ael Capitolism is a system like nature. It rains on the good and evil equally, and Capitolism is hard to control. Supply and demand are king with capitolism. If the customers don't like the product they can buy a better one somewhere else. Companies compete and it drives down prices (This benefits the average person). in general Capitolism is a tool that helps anyone willing to do honest work. It operates much like God's command to Adam and Eve to till the land and be industrious. "By the Sweat of your brow shall ye have bread." People are easily corrupted. No doubt. I think that rich people aren't bad because they make a lot of money. They are bad when they do not use the money God has allowed them to help others and to serve the lord. Give the evil to the people who misues capitolism, but let a system that benefits you more reliably than any system you have tried before run. Not having Jobs is socialism's fault not Capitolism's. They are opposites and people aren't Saying Obama is putting socialist policies in play out of the blue or because it makes them feel important. Conservatism according to Sam)(ael Conservatism means preserving what acctually works until we find something better. The only reason conservatives shoot down ideas is when they don't work. Usually the people who bring up these fancy new ideas are trying to sell use the equivilent of a credit card. It might be able to do a few kinda cool things but the interest is enslaving. Look at what credit cards do to people all in the name of freedom. A person is free right? Well after they use their freedom to wrack up $4,000 on a credit card at 25% interest they aren't all that free any more are they? If they are living from hand to mouth like most people they are just going to have to spend more on a credit card until eventually the hole they are in is too deep to get out. This is the idea of much of the politically popular ideas going on right now, and its why the conservatives are freaking out so much right now. We are being offered shiny new toys right NOW!!! (But it will force us into a death spiral of debt and financial problems that will take our credability and freedoms to the dump in exchange for a truely meaningless object in all truth.) Think about a newborn baby. Fresh. New. No crimes and no greed. Perfect. Christlike in it's innocense. A Baby represents hope for a new and better day. I say this seriously. Its one of the beautiful things in life we can really appreciate that reminds us how glorious God is. The rightness of His plan. Because of JUST president Obama's stimulus plan that baby will have to pay $130,000 in taxes during it's lifetime. That doesn't take into account the taxes we already pay and more we might pay if obama makes another assault on the national credit card. Where does that baby's hope go if it was born into financial slavery? Obviously faith in Christ can deliver us from all, but I think Jesus would want us to spare our children from such evil. That means choosing to save money instead of spend it. Conservative if you ask me. Socialism (A Note from Sam)(ael) Socialism is a construct of the government. It means that the government controls more and the people control less. It has some really attractive offers. Socialist groups can promise you Master Kai that you will have free medicare just because you are a citizen. Wow! Isn't that tempting? And you Silmerion get another great offer. Socialism says that if you decide not to work because you have been laid off, they will pay you not to work with welfare! In fact, you can earn more money that someone on minimum wage for sitting around if you choose to. You don't have to worry about a Job. Whether or not you have one Socialism can put money in your pocket. That is a tempting offer no? Problems? Eventually Master Kai, no matter how much money you are willing to spend, your 4-year-old daughter gets a number when her ear mysteriously explodes and starts bleeding desperately. You see, the government runs medicare. All of it. They had to kill all other medical professions that weren't government to make you the free medicare promise. Now everyone who has an itch that they suspect gets equal treatment, including people who contribute nothing to society or have become medically paranoid. You wait in line and tell your child that it's the government's fault she has to bleed for three hours before a tired nurse might even see her, but you voted for them right? Isn't it you who did this? (I say this just as a personal example. This literally happened in cuba so take it seriously.) Now Master Silmerion is a smart Gal, (as we all know, lol) so instead of working she takes the welfare check. So do a lot of people who are just quite frankly capable of working but who are irresponsible or basically lazy. Now the 50% of the people still trying to make an honest living (the people who are running the nation in every position except government ost likly) are getting paid less than the welfare people because companies can get away with murder now that the government owns them or regulates them with nigh on the authority of God Himself (and no less scrutiny). Now when capitolism has been done away with there is no real point in getting a great education is there? You can't become a CEO any more because it doesn't pay any better than being a Janitor and its a harder job anyway. Socialism takes all the rich people's money and gives it to the poor. (Or should I say the lazy). Suddenly education is relative. Who really cares when it isn't necessary? Suddenly even work is relative. Who cares when I could be living on welfare like the other 50%? Then you have a problem because no one is cleaning the gas station (or running it). No one is polishing the presiden't boots. No one is working at the hospital unless its purely on charity. Nothing works when the government makes promises that destroy our motivations. Free is a scary word. everything is always being paid for, but with 'free' they won't tell you who pays and usually its because its you. |
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| Kai Stormwalker | Apr 20 2009, 01:58 PM Post #89 |
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Master Sentinel/Scholar/Healer
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I'm not saying that you are wrong, only that you are looking at things from a human viewpoint rather than God's viewpoint. God's economics are far different from man's. There really isn't any reason to continue discussing this. Since I used to be LDS I know that this is what your church teaches. But it is contrary to the teachings of Jesus. |
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| Sam)(ael | Apr 20 2009, 06:54 PM Post #90 |
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Jedi Knight Scholar
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Please understand that I take nothing for granted save the air I breathe and not always that. This is what I believe. Whatever church you left Master Kai and whatever reasons have nothing to do with politics. The LDS church actually stays almost completely out of politics period. They recently participated in the latest prop 102 issue here, and before that probably 60 years went by with only the counsel to vote and vote wisely. I agree with you Master Kai. But I bet God's economics actually work without divine intervention, which might be required for some of the ideas encompassed here to work. Faith in christ isn't supposed to make you blind to dollars and cents. He also created the laws the universe operates on. If suzan for instance has zero apples, she has zero apples to give the poor despite all the good intentions man ever produced. I say this with Love and I apologize for the length of the text. I believe politics is my responsability to do wisely and I have spent great efforts learning the process and the current situation and past history. |
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