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Saddam executed; ...justice or vengeance?
Topic Started: Dec 30 2006, 10:56 PM (217 Views)
Eral
Kopi Luwak
One of his daughters is describing Saddam as a martyr. :huh: Looking at it one way, he was a martyr, killed for his beliefs and actions. Since his main belief was that he should maintain absolute power and control of the country for his own benefit, and his actions were to kill a lot of people to ensure his grip on government, I'm betting that not terribly many people are feeling all that sympathetic.

In one way, I see his hanging as similar to the fate meted out to commandants of death camps: it had to be brutal, because of the repugnance of his crimes. At first, the questions raised about his trial concerned me, and I wondered whether an international court would be better: but it's not like there is really a question of his guilt. The real question was: prison or execution?
One headline here quotes a witness to his death as saying he was broken and afraid: all the other reports say he was very stoic. He lived by the sword, after all.

Very different fate to Pinochet.
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Spuddiwinkinses
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Reply: Vengeance, like all other executions.

There is no "justice" in killing someone for having killed someone else, in my personal view.
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Blood_Raven
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Come burn with me.
If I was him, I would have went out in a blaze of glory when the US first invaded Iraq. I would have lead my troops into the final fight in the defense of Baghdad. At least his death would have meant something, he would have gained some respect of the people. The glorious leader fighting until the very end against the infidel.

But no. We have your typical coward who didn't give a damn about anyone but himself who was captured hiding in a hole in the ground. How glorious. Soon we had a kangaroo court that sentence him to death, meeting his end dangling by a rope. Now history will remember you as the coward that got caught in a hole in the ground and was hung by your people.
TheFrozen North forums. Where it's at.
Mood for today: Perfection
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Joe
Coffea Canephora
Blood_Raven
Dec 30 2006, 04:43 PM
If I was him, I would have went out in a blaze of glory when the US first invaded Iraq. I would have lead my troops into the final fight in the defense of Baghdad. At least his death would have meant something, he would have gained some respect of the people. The glorious leader fighting until the very end against the infidel.

Stop playing RPGs.

Anyway, I do believe that in most cases, capital punishment is based on vengeance and doesn't really bring justice to anyone.

I think Saddam's case is different, however, not because of what he has done, but because of who he is. We really are better off with him in the ground. Now he can't boast and hoot and holler about the things he did to a people who are suffering greatly, most of which he was both directly and indirectly responsible for.
In the shadow of the light from a black sun
Frigid statue standing icy blue and numb
Where are the frost giants I've begged for protection?
I'm freezing
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Blood_Raven
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Come burn with me.
:bex:
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Krazy
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I haz powah!
I think I'm (partly) with Blood_Raven.

And I think the West has had a part in this and the blood is on their hands, they stood back and let Saddam get on with his crimes only intervening when he invaded Kuwait because the world is so obsessed with oil and money. Which is the same reason they don't bother ousting all the dictators in Africa (no oil) and sell them arms instead on the pretence if we didn't someone else will.

And this execution is to partly make the West feel better, that they can say some good came of invading Iraq. Hey look we got rid of a nasty dictator under the guise of democracy. Fools no-one.

As for Saddam, I don't agree with the death penalty, I'm sure some other more intelligent punishment could have been devised but as usual humanity resorts to its base lust for blood. Shame really.
"Well, ‘course dis one’s betta! It’s lotz ‘eavier, and gots dem spikey bitz on de ends. "
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Eral
Kopi Luwak
Saddam lived his life on the stage: he always put on the army man act, but he preferred stealthy killing. His last words about driving out enemies were completely hollow: when it came to the final fight, he ran. He put on a show at the end, but that's what he always did. The idea that he was hanged because he would have been too annoying to keep alive is very Manly Pink.

He completely brutalised Iraq: the court looked shonky, because there's been no justice system for years. A country that's been ruled by secret police for years isn't going to come up with noble and humanitarian responses. Hell, I'm amazed they found two defence teams.

Bush and Co certainly shouldn't be talking too much about the democracy we have brought to Iraq. It's not the kind of democracy we're used to. I think they are spinning desperately so it won't look like a Palestinian-style democracy: where we will only accept the outcome of your elections and judicial processes if we like them.
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Blood_Raven
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Come burn with me.
Quote:
 
Saddam lived his life on the stage: he always put on the army man act, but he preferred stealthy killing. His last words about driving out enemies were completely hollow: when it came to the final fight, he ran. He put on a show at the end, but that's what he always did. The idea that he was hanged because he would have been too annoying to keep alive is very Manly Pink.
yeah thats what i was saying, When the chip were down he ran like a goddamned coward. O NOES! The USA is here! Run, everyone for themselves!!!!!!!!!
TheFrozen North forums. Where it's at.
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lara
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Kopi Luwak
I thought this was interesting

Especially considering it ran on page 2 of the right-wing tabloid I used to work for.
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Eral
Kopi Luwak
That is interesting: but I think the author is underestimating the enemity Shi'ites had for Saddam, and their willingness to see him dead. I believe that the American government wanted him executed: their dismissal of his appeal shows that. But I think his death was more of an appeasement of the new Iraqi government : it was reportedly very popular with the Iraqi community here.
Everyone knows that Saddam received support from America. The fact that he was shouting "Down with America" on the scaffolding suggests that he had no secrets he wanted to expose.

I kind of admire the scheming behind the appeal. If American courts had considered it, they would have been seen as protecting him. But since they didn't, they have denied him justice. Gotta admire Saddam's legal team.
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Regullus
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Reliant
The article is not exactly a surprising point of view from Margolis.

Iran/Iraq War

US (and others) Role in Iran/Iraq War

Edited to Add Random but Hilarious (imo) Fark Headline Re: The Softer Side of SH:

Quote:
 
Saddam in repose - an avid reader of poetry, enjoyed feeding birds and talking about his family. Oh dear God, what have we done ?
tempus_teapot
 
I'd like to add that at this point I have taken my Spider Jerusalem action figure and tied his wrist to my Cassidy (from Preacher) action figure just so I can work out which positions are feasible with them and which aren't.

Read that and weep, internet. Weep!

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Boeing
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Yellow
Neither. IMO, a means of satisfaction for those who have suffered at his hands. Doesn't automatically make it justice though.
I want you. I want you so bad. I want you so bad it's driving me mad. She's so heavy!
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